Virge's Swing.

[virge666]

So a few months into it and what has happened. I am lucky enough to spend a bit of time with Martin but have not played any golf.
3 rounds in 10 weeks is no way to keep a low handicap. If it wasn't for Phil and some cored greens... I think my scores would be in the mid twenties.

I am happy with the progression, the odd pull shot is nothing to be too scared of, my pitching is OK for a rusty player... but the big change is the thought process.

This method has one hand-action for the whole swing... the twirling action. You simply aim your body and execute the twirling action... for a technical player like myself - this is a nice thing to have. There are no other thoughts... just aim and execute.

I am not at a good enough level for it to be proficient... but the video looks good and should get better once the lateral move into the ball subsides a bit.

Anyway - latest video is here... apologies for the shitty frame rate - it is the best i can do at night.

Enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DVOKpX4Fv8

[Captain Nemo]

That it!

[razaar]

Looks good mate.

[Yossarian]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r09Gi...eature=related

This one is better

[Jono]

Virge, your use of the term "twirling" is interesting.

I don't know whether you mean the same thing, but I have been using the twirling action for some time in my swing ever since I read Dan Shauger's book. Dan Shauger supposedly teaches the Mike Austin swing, which some people find debatable. Anyway, I've definately noticed increase in distance using the twirling action as opposed to the traditional hand action.

EDIT: Never mind ... I just read your previous posts and your definition of twirling is probably different to mine ...

[PeteyD]

Some of the footballers I know have an interesting definition of twirling .... helicoptors etc.

[sol381]

looks very compact yet powerful. nice swing.. not much looks like could go wrong with that swing except when it gets quick could get a pull /hook here and there.

[virge666]

Virge, your use of the term "twirling" is interesting.

EDIT: Never mind ... I just read your previous posts and your definition of twirling is probably different to mine ...

I have given the twirl on the way down away... I think I know what Martin means, I am just not at that level yet. Maybe in a couple of weeks as I learn to move the ball both ways. I only have a 5m-10m fade at present and the straight shot.

looks very compact yet powerful. nice swing.. not much looks like could go wrong with that swing except when it gets quick could get a pull /hook here and there.

I get pulls and pushes just depending on where my body is on the downswing... if my upper body goes backwards - i get the pull, if I slide into impact - I get the push. if my hips go forward and my shoulders go back - i get the pull cut. All of which I can play golf with, without missing the golf course.

The lack of swing thoughts is a big advantage for me.

[sol381]

I agree. the less you think the better you hit.

[virge666]

I agree. the less you think the better you hit.

For years I have been told to focus on a "motion" and not a position. I have got it half right rehearsing motions to positions and then trying to match all motions up. It works - but not under pressure and not at the higher level.

For me - it is like driving a manual car - when you first learnt, it was all about matching up the friction point of the clutch with the revs and findind the right gears and all that kind of thing. After a few months though - you just do this automatically - their is no concentration at all on how to change gears or match up the clutch.

I want my concentration on aiming and executing, not on how to aim or how to execute.

Easier said than done, especially under pressure.

[sol381]

how many other sports do you focus on movement or technique.. imagine a tennis player or cricketer,baseball player etc.. thinking about their swing during a shot.. all they are focused on is hitting the ball and where that ball is going.. the difference is they have a split second to decide whereas golfers have all the time in the world and the ball is stationary. try even throwing a ball and thinking about the throw rather than the target.. you'll have no chance.. the only thing i focus on is the ball and trying to get the club head to hit the back of it..if you are aligned right and have the right club you are never too far from the target.. work on technique at the range and leave it there when you play. just hit the ball.

[markTHEblake]

have you always been that narrow? (backswing). When I think about and try the Marty twirl thats how it seems to happen to me.
(though I dont profess to be able to do it, i lost my way when I busted my shoulder and have not tried any of it since)

[virge666]

how many other sports do you focus on movement or technique.. imagine a tennis player or cricketer,baseball player etc.. thinking about their swing during a shot.. all they are focused on is hitting the ball and where that ball is going.. the difference is they have a split second to decide whereas golfers have all the time in the world and the ball is stationary. try even throwing a ball and thinking about the throw rather than the target.. you'll have no chance.. the only thing i focus on is the ball and trying to get the club head to hit the back of it..if you are aligned right and have the right club you are never too far from the target.. work on technique at the range and leave it there when you play. just hit the ball.

Amen brother !

Awesome post - also easier to say than do and it only works on the course when you are hitting it where you want to... if your not - then you are searching for WHY you are not.

This is where the change is... I am now fixing it by continually rehearsing the action... not looking for a position to be in on the way down. I am now not looking to FIX anything - I have the right motion - i just need to execute that motion...

As a golf player - that is just awesome.

have you always been that narrow? (backswing). When I think about and try the Marty twirl thats how it seems to happen to me.
(though I dont profess to be able to do it, i lost my way when I busted my shoulder and have not tried any of it since)

To be honest - and it is an Edwin and Marty thing - I just dont care about width.. or let me rephrase that - I dont care about width of the clubhead.

My left arm is straight-ish and it is very straight by 9'oclock on the down swing . . . so I just dont care about the backswing.

In fact - one thing that I have learn from Edwin and been reinforced by Marty is that, THE position at the top... and I mean THAT position at the top is the only thing I care about... how I get there, and the path it takes is now just not an issue.

As long as I get to THAT position, i have a stable pivot and I can unleash it all on the ball without sliding or losing my balance.

The back is a bit sore after 18 holes . . . so the next step will probably be to reduce the power a bit so I don't need the 3 beers at the clubhouse to loosen the back up.

[Scifisicko]

In fact - one thing that I have learn from Edwin and been reinforced by Marty is that, THE position at the top... and I mean THAT position at the top is the only thing I care about... how I get there, and the path it takes is now just not an issue.

Ive recently come to the same conclusion. Ive pissed away a lot of effort on my backswing.

[virge666]

Ive recently come to the same conclusion. Ive pissed away a lot of effort on my backswing.

Even Tennis starts at the end of the backswing . . . golf is stupid sport that has too many fundementals that should be ignored.

The grip is another one... a good grip is only good if you have a good fundementals.

[Scifisicko]

Yeah, the harder i pivot the stronger i make my grip (sigh)

[Jarro]

Any updates here Virge ?

[virge666]

Shit yeah !

Heaps and heaps happening, trying to hit it properly for the upcoming Pennant Season. I have gone 100% Phil with short game and pitching and my long game I have started cupping the left wrist on the backswing and float loading the downswing.

The aim is to see just how far I can hit it and then see how far I can hit it with a balanced swing. I have been playing with some professionals lately and I am pretty happy with most parts of it.

I will do some video on Thursday and upload it.

[Jarro]

Sounds very interesting Virge ..... keep us informed

[Jono]

I have started cupping the left wrist on the backswing and float loading the downswing.

Virge, when I asked you at the champs what you meant by the term "twirl", you mentioned that it's the way you throw the club in front of you. When you say you are float loading, are you still doing the twirl move?

[Jarro]

The aim is to see just how far I can hit it and then see how far I can hit it with a balanced swing.

This is the comment that most interested me.

Being an ex-baseballer and handy cricketer (one day Jack) i've always tended to want to smash the living bejesus (sorry Blakey) out of the pill !!

Sometimes i tell myself to slow down and try and smooth it out there, and get great results, but the smash tendancy is too strong to resist

I know when i tried the Edwin stuff i had a more controlled swing, but i always thought it wasn't going to get me the distance i wanted and after a while i tried going back to the hit it mentality.

Very interested to hear about your results Virge.

[davepuppies]

Will you fly me by 30 with the new swing Virge????

We are due for a game!

[edhannan]

Following your progress and glad to hear of your success. I'm interested to know your thoughts about how much, if at all, you've moved away from Gary Edwin's pattern.

Two questions:
- Should the front knee flex established at setup increase during the backswing? (It appears to in the Edwin models, but I'm thinking that may be an illusion.)
- If the increased flex should not occur but does happen in your own swing, might that account for your long-standing complaint about a low right arse on the downswing?

[virge666]

Ed,

My translation of your questions...

- Not important... your over thinking it.
- Please see above.

The Edwin swing is a throw, like a baseball swing, like a tennis shot, like passsing a football. Go and rehearse these actions and tell me what you your knees and the respective flex is.

What you have to find a practice motion that gives you the end result . . . I have an very old edwin drill that I use to rehearse the motion. I will take some video of it next week and show you it.

The big change for me is the downswing as you will see by the video attached... I have fix my setup - which was appalling and this has helped change my downswing to avoid the low right arse.

The more you try and copy positions other than setup - the more trouble you are going to get into... and also the more confused you will be.

You need to find the motion that will give you the positions - not try and copy the positions to try and get the motion. Check out Gaz's video called "Impact is Everything"

Anyway - here you go.

[Puji]

what are you playing off these days virge?