LIV Golf

[pt73]

Greg Norman only gives a shit about Greg Norman.

Nice work R&A

Exactly what Wayne Grady said a while ago.

[Matt 3 Jab]

Maybe. But regardless, he’s earned his place. It’s a champions dinner and he’s a 2x champion. This is a bitch move by sherry soaked toffs of the R&A.

Agree.

Would they have done the same if tiger took the cash?

I highly doubt it.

And they invited Phil. So there seems something personal with it. Which makes it more petty than business.

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[pt73]

Well I’m sure Greg will recover from the snubbing, he’s managed to get over the high profile collapses in his career.

[pt73]

https://www.golfmonthly.com/news/rep...-at-150th-open

[Matt 3 Jab]

https://golf.com/news/pga-tour-feder...ion-liv/?amp=1

Interesting re a new antitrust / anti competition investigation. Will be a slow progress now in the courts and dare say bans may be lifted until the outcome is determined etc

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[jimandr]

https://golf.com/news/pga-tour-feder...ion-liv/?amp=1

Interesting re a new antitrust / anti competition investigation. Will be a slow progress now in the courts and dare say bans may be lifted until the outcome is determined etc

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I saw that and I had two thoughts, despite the confidence of the PGA spokeperson. I'm no expert on US anti-competition legislation though.

Firstly, I'd think the PGA is on shaky ground, because clearly their actions are designed to discourage competition. However, the world rankings aren't determined by the PGA, so that may not be relevant.

Secondly, I'd think LIV would be subject to the same concerns. Clearly their actions in paying what are unsustainably large retainers is just as anti-competitive. If questions were asked by the investigators, they may get the answer we all want to hear about LIV's long term plan, which should be to turn the PGA Tour into a feeder tour for their events. And what is 'competitive' about that.

[Matt 3 Jab]

I saw that and I had two thoughts, despite the confidence of the PGA spokeperson. I'm no expert on US anti-competition legislation though.

Firstly, I'd think the PGA is on shaky ground, because clearly their actions are designed to discourage competition. However, the world rankings aren't determined by the PGA, so that may not be relevant.

Secondly, I'd think LIV would be subject to the same concerns. Clearly their actions in paying what are unsustainably large retainers is just as anti-competitive. If questions were asked by the investigators, they may get the answer we all want to hear about LIV's long term plan, which should be to turn the PGA Tour into a feeder tour for their events. And what is 'competitive' about that.

The PGA, as does the DP world, have seats at the OWGR ranking table. So they do have some input.

From a few things I've read, the PGA is stating they abided by their rules for the bans, but then comes the question as to if their rules are fair or not (or anti competitive or not)

I believe this has been looked at before back in the 1990's but there may have been changes since that time in case law.

LIV would surely only need to say that it's players have contracts to their 14 events and are free to do whatever they like outside that. Unlike PGA, they aren't bound by having to treat each player the same as a member organisation. So they can feed money however they like to players and allow them greater freedoms to play elsewhere.

It's interesting none the less.

IF LIV get over the line, it may inspire other non Saudi businesses to create a tour alternative. Who knows. But the snow globe has been shaken up and it'll take a while to settle and have any clear outcome.


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[virge666]

Not sure if this has been asked ... but how is the LIV tour any different from the DP Tour or the Asian Tour. (other than stupid amounts of $$$)

It is just another tour...

The DP Tour dont get all cranky that some of their players go over to the USA and play and vice versa... the propaganda on this whole thing is out of control, just let the players play where they want and get on with your lives.

I also dont buy the Saudi money side... its not like the USA has never kept anyone illegally and killed anyone that wasnt in their interests. I can name 10 sports right now that dont have this issue at all.

Rich old white people getting cranky that they arent the biggest dog in the neighborhood anymore and creating a slander campaign to try and sway public opinion.

(off my soap box now)

[markTHEblake]

^^
Yep. The entire drama is all the PGAs doing. They could have just said to the players "if you dont keep yoour committments to our tour(circa 14 events), then thats your choice"

As for Saudi human rights, 150-200 million murdered in the 20th century alone, half of those by a govt thats still in power.

The Saudis alleged crime is murdering a journalist. Th medie therefore all jump on that bandwagon, they stick up for their own look at how australian media treated the indonesians for most of the last 30 years.

If Kasshoggi was a priest nobody would care, just like they dont care that they need communists to make their iphones

[ParkRoyal]

^^
Yep. The entire drama is all the PGAs doing. They could have just said to the players "if you dont keep yoour committments to our tour(circa 14 events), then thats your choice"

As for Saudi human rights, 150-200 million murdered in the 20th century alone, half of those by a govt thats still in power.

The Saudis alleged crime is murdering a journalist. Th medie therefore all jump on that bandwagon, they stick up for their own look at how australian media treated the indonesians for most of the last 30 years.

If Kasshoggi was a priest nobody would care, just like they dont care that they need communists to make their iphones

Yeah its just the murder of a journalist that people are shitty about. Great take.

[markTHEblake]

Yeah its just the murder of a journalist that people are shitty about..

Yes exactly.

[sms316]

Journalists like to think of themselves as being above the law.

[Yossarian]

Anyone that plays golf is in as much of an ethical pickle as the LIV players.

[pt73]

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/Ope...th-bridgestone

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/ope...shoulder-randa

[pt73]

https://www.palmbeachpost.com/story/...y/10045995002/

[AndyP]

Cam gone to LIV too? This would be pretty big from an Aussie point of view.

Cameron Smith The Open LIV Golf | Smith's LIV defection could crush the PGA Tour (nine.com.au)

[chappy1970]

Cam gone to LIV too? This would be pretty big from an Aussie point of view.

Cameron Smith The Open LIV Golf | Smith's LIV defection could crush the PGA Tour (nine.com.au)

Was there a figure of $100mill being thrown around

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[rickie prowler]

Leish Cam and Scotty gone after the presidents cup being widely reported. Heidiki gone for a reported $350M also

[WBennett]

I have flipped.

It's going to be awesome.

14 events live on pay per view, $50 a week to watch best of the best, UFC style.

How else does the promotion ever get a return on investment?

[sms316]

The Saudis are known for their philanthropy and don’t need a return. Teams will be sponsored which might cover 5% of the cost.


The way it’s going they’re going to have better fields than most PGA Toyr events. Less players really is more.

Hope they bring one event here.

[pt73]

Was there a figure of $100mill being thrown around

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A close mate of mine was at the Open and was told by an Aussie pro that they originally offered Cam $70m but you would expect that to be over $200m now.

David Feherty reportedly gone too.

[WBennett]

The Saudis are known for their philanthropy and don’t need a return. Teams will be sponsored which might cover 5% of the cost.


The way it’s going they’re going to have better fields than most PGA Toyr events. Less players really is more.

Hope they bring one event here.

A field of Fatprick Read, Pat Perez, Paul Casey and Lee Westwood. Shut up and take my money.

[WBennett]

Crystal balling time.

Looking 2 years into the future, Liv has signed 25 players of the world top 50 players, not just the unpopular flogs but the young up and comers. Cam Smith, Cam Young, and in their biggest coup, Jordan Speith.

They can't play PGA tour events, but can play in majors based on exemptions and results. Are their events still on youtube? Pay per view?

Would you pay $50 to watch the Majestics vs the Aussie BallTearers featuring Scotty, Smithy, Leish and JDay at Trump Doral as the players go for the 50mil jackpot?


Then you have the legacy tours.
Does the Euro tour collapses as the Ryder Cup has lost its shine and can't prop up the tour profits, and is now taken over by the Liv/Asian secondary tour?

Is PGA tour is decimated, as all their sponsorship and TV deals are based on strength of field numbers?
As TV ratings have collapsed due to the Superleague war part 2, are the cross subsidised secondary tours of KF, Canada, Latin America etc gone?
Does the Sunshine or whatever remains of an Aussie Tour attract players to make them viable? Is it the Aussie Open presented by Cam Smith and Aramco?

[sms316]

The Australian “Tour” won’t have the cods to ban any Liv contracted player from playing events. They get next to nobody playing now so they will have no chance of getting sponsors to prop up events.

Other tours will struggle to keep the dollars flowing in as well (except Asia).

I can genuinely see this being the best thing that’s happened to golf in a long time. America thinks that the world revolves around it and they have what’s coming to them now that somebody has the financial backing.

[Dotty]

I am happy to not follow most sports, especially those with players on excessive non-incentive based retainers.
If those 3 Aussies go to LIV, then I will enjoy not following professional golf.

Due to product association with these prima donnas, I would also seriously think about not playing amateur golf.
On the plus side, I will be rich not paying annual subs (to clubs and GA), comp fees, off course retailers, OEMs, visitor fees, etc.