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Thread: Covid-19

  1. #51
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    Social media is such an evil. For those that are interested, look up ‘The Cutter Incident’ from the 1950s. In the very early days of the polio vaccine, around 200,000 American children were given a faulty vaccine in which the process of inactiving the live virus component didn’t work. The result was that around 1 in 5 of those children actually developed polio, rather than being vaccinated against it. It’s a really complicated and quite horrifying story and one I explore with our students.

    However, the most important part is that this led to better regulation of vaccinations and the process continued. If it happened now, the spread of rumour and innuendo on social media would completely undermine the entire vaccination system and it would all fall apart.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Burgundy View Post
    Of course young fit people should get the vaccine.
    Thats an interesting observation, what do you think would be the benefit? being vaccinated doesnt stop anyone from getting covid, and doesnt stop them from being infectious either. A young healthy persons immuno system will effectively fight the covid virus, many wont even know they had it.

    Every vaccine is intended to be given to young people, that’s the whole point of them and why we get them as kids
    We get those as kids to prevent suffering or death for kids. Covid is not one of these (for kids)
    This is no different and they’re remarkably safe.
    The 25yo nurse on the gold coast that got blood clots last week from AZ also wouldnt agree with the view that its remarkably safe.

    Its the very short trial period, which is what some people are concerned about and that's reasonable. Did you read what Dotty wrote about Thalidomide.

    After all everyone was concerned about exactly that when the bad orange man announced a vaccine would be ready by Dec 2020 because and he was widely derided for the delusional claim. "it takes years" they said "we will refuse such a vaccine" they said. In less than 12 months, those critics of the quick vaccine now want to mandate it, and those who express concerns about the vaccine are now officially labelled as terrorists.
    Last edited by markTHEblake; 19th August 2021 at 09:18 PM.
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  3. #53
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    Gee whiz.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by markTHEblake View Post
    Thats an interesting observation, what do you think would be the benefit? being vaccinated doesnt stop anyone from getting covid, and doesnt stop them from being infectious either. A young healthy persons immuno system will effectively fight the covid virus, many wont even know they had it.


    We get those as kids to prevent suffering or death for kids. Covid is not one of these (for kids)

    The 25yo nurse on the gold coast that got blood clots last week from AZ also wouldnt agree with the view that its remarkably safe.

    Its the very short trial period, which is what some people are concerned about and that's reasonable. Did you read what Dotty wrote about Thalidomide.

    After all everyone was concerned about exactly that when the bad orange man announced a vaccine would be ready by Dec 2020 because and he was widely derided for the delusional claim. "it takes years" they said "we will refuse such a vaccine" they said. In less than 12 months, those critics of the quick vaccine now want to mandate it, and those who express concerns about the vaccine are now officially labelled as terrorists.
    Nut job.

  5. #55
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    Was cycling with my old group this morning, and one of the gp's (most of the group are doctors) was talking vaccines with one member that hasn't be vaccinated and didn't seem to be in a rush. He was telling him mrna vaccines have been around since the 80's, and AZ was used with the first SARS outbreaks. Coronavirus's aren't new, and to think work on vaccines hasn't been ongoing for years........ But there hasn't been the flood of money dropped into it like now, and there hasn't been one of these virus's where you are infectious without showing symptoms! That is the killer here! All the others you weren't infectious till symptoms developed, making it much easier to contain.

    Myself, I think we'll get to 80%. Especially if they start bringing in vaccine requirements for attending and participating in stuff. Maybe dropping FTB A and B for those unvaccinated without a medical exemption?
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  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by markTHEblake View Post
    Thats an interesting observation, what do you think would be the benefit? being vaccinated doesnt stop anyone from getting covid, and doesnt stop them from being infectious either. A young healthy persons immuno system will effectively fight the covid virus, many wont even know they had it. We get those as kids to prevent suffering or death for kids. Covid is not one of these (for kids)The 25yo nurse on the gold coast that got blood clots last week from AZ also wouldnt agree with the view that its remarkably safe.Its the very short trial period, which is what some people are concerned about and that's reasonable. Did you read what Dotty wrote about Thalidomide. After all everyone was concerned about exactly that when the bad orange man announced a vaccine would be ready by Dec 2020 because and he was widely derided for the delusional claim. "it takes years" they said "we will refuse such a vaccine" they said. In less than 12 months, those critics of the quick vaccine now want to mandate it, and those who express concerns about the vaccine are now officially labelled as terrorists.
    I’m not quite sure what to do with any of that other than thank you for reinforcing my point about Facebook.
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    Since we can't "like" posts, there's three smileys for 3 recent posts.
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  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by goughy View Post
    Was cycling with my old group this morning, and one of the gp's (most of the group are doctors) was talking vaccines with one member that hasn't be vaccinated and didn't seem to be in a rush. He was telling him mrna vaccines have been around since the 80's, and AZ was used with the first SARS outbreaks. Coronavirus's aren't new, and to think work on vaccines hasn't been ongoing for years........ But there hasn't been the flood of money dropped into it like now, and there hasn't been one of these virus's where you are infectious without showing symptoms! That is the killer here! All the others you weren't infectious till symptoms developed, making it much easier to contain.
    Good (and accurate) information there.

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    Doubled Phizzered as of Wednesday, felt pretty flat yesterday, but pretty good now. They are running a pretty tight ship at the Bellerive Oval hub. Any Hobartians (of any age) should be able to get in now, there wasn't anything that stopped me (3 getting it.

    Tas seems to be doing well on getting people jabbed and its really good to see NSW numbers jumping too.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart View Post
    Good (and accurate) information there.
    And FB was not used in the creation of that post!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Burgundy View Post
    I’m not quite sure what to do with any of that other than thank you for reinforcing my point about Facebook.
    Understood why you appear not understand.

    I dont read facebook and I work in biological sciences industry. Whilst thats not my expertise, my clients (and colleagues) are the experts in the field of virus research. Most of my understanding of what is happening around us comes asking the boss to explain stuff to me and reading New Scientist in the dunny. Whilst i obviously dont have political diacussions with my clients the genereral consensus is they are just as fed up with lockdowns as the rest of us.

    I find it comical that most are fully trusting the government. Since when has that ever happened.

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    Did anyone have side effects for the first shot and not the second ?

    The first one - left me lethargic with a bit of a headache... 2nd one did bugger all.

    2nd one probably a placebo..

  13. #63

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    There's people fully trusting whatever random crap they read on all sorts of unreliable websites about this too. What happened to the old "most of what's posted on the internet is rubbish"? For some it's suddenly not.

    Or they focus on a relative handful of bad outcomes and blow it way out of proportion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    Did anyone have side effects for the first shot and not the second ?
    Welcome to ozgolf!
    Pretty much thats my experience with pfizer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kelsey86 View Post
    There's people fully trusting whatever random crap they read on all sorts of unreliable websites about this too. What happened to the old "most of what's posted on the internet is rubbish"? For some it's suddenly not.

    Or they focus on a relative handful of bad outcomes and blow it way out of proportion.
    One of the Sydney protesters from yesterday said she would rather die than get vaccinated.

    Might just get her wish.

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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    Did anyone have side effects for the first shot and not the second ?

    The first one - left me lethargic with a bit of a headache... 2nd one did bugger all.

    2nd one probably a placebo..
    Generally, people have reported higher rates of minor side effects with first dose of AZ, then less with second dose, while the reverse has been observed for Pfizer.

    But that is very much across the entire population, and you can always find a few people who report the opposite. Interestingly, I haven’t come across many people who have complained of a very strong negative response to both first and second dose of either one.

    Edit: Can see a bit of a breakdown on this at ncirs.org.au - look for the article in June (ish) about side effects of Pfizer.
    Last edited by Stuart; 22nd August 2021 at 04:33 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pt73 View Post
    One of the Sydney protesters from yesterday said she would rather die than get vaccinated.Might just get her wish.
    Probably not, unless she is old or has a pre-existing medical condition.

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    Quote Originally Posted by markTHEblake View Post

    I find it comical that most are fully trusting the government. Since when has that ever happened.
    Definitely don’t trust the government - you would have to be bonkers to do that! Do follow the science though.

    There is a very interesting comparison around the difference between annual influenza and Covid-19. In 2019, Australia had around 300,000 cases of the flu, and around 1000 deaths, mostly amongst the elderly and people with significant morbidities. No-one batted an eyelid at those figures (politically anyway), so we already know what level of infection/death that government is happy to accept for this type of disease.

    In 2020 and 2021, we have had the lowest ever rates of flu largely due to our increased personal hygiene (hand washing, face masks etc), even in states without any lockdowns, and almost zero deaths. If we go back to ‘normal’, are we happy to also accept a return to 1000 deaths annually from the flu?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart View Post
    we go back to ‘normal’, are we happy to also accept a return to 1000 deaths annually from the flu?
    Excellent discussion point! I suspect there will never be a return to 'normal', such as masks, social diatancing and tracking permanently.

    Thanks for sharing the rest. Interesting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart View Post
    Definitely don’t trust the government - you would have to be bonkers to do that! Do follow the science though.

    There is a very interesting comparison around the difference between annual influenza and Covid-19. In 2019, Australia had around 300,000 cases of the flu, and around 1000 deaths, mostly amongst the elderly and people with significant morbidities. No-one batted an eyelid at those figures (politically anyway), so we already know what level of infection/death that government is happy to accept for this type of disease.

    In 2020 and 2021, we have had the lowest ever rates of flu largely due to our increased personal hygiene (hand washing, face masks etc), even in states without any lockdowns, and almost zero deaths. If we go back to ‘normal’, are we happy to also accept a return to 1000 deaths annually from the flu?
    Comparison between flu and COVID hospitalisations (general/ICU) would be interesting.

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    Don't quote me 100% on this, but from memory in 2019 there were around 4,000 hospitalisations for influenza, with roughly a quarter of those dying (as per previous 1000 figure).

    If you want to go looking, there is lots of (Department of Health) data here: https://www1.health.gov.au/internet/...lu-flucurr.htm

    Some interesting points:

    • In the year (2021) to date, of the 462 notifications of laboratory-confirmed influenza, no influenza-associated deaths have been notified.
    • There have been no hospital admissions due to influenza reported across sentinel hospitals sites since commencement of surveillance in April 2021.
    Last edited by Stuart; 22nd August 2021 at 06:24 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart View Post
    Don't quote me 100% on this, but from memory in 2019 there were around 4,000 hospitalisations for influenza, with roughly a quarter of those dying (as per previous 1000 figure).

    If you want to go looking, there is lots of (Department of Health) data here: https://www1.health.gov.au/internet/...lu-flucurr.htm

    Some interesting points:

    • In the year (2021) to date, of the 462 notifications of laboratory-confirmed influenza, no influenza-associated deaths have been notified.
    • There have been no hospital admissions due to influenza reported across sentinel hospitals sites since commencement of surveillance in April 2021.
    Cheers. Looks like something to browse when work’s quiet

  23. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by pt73 View Post
    One of the Sydney protesters from yesterday said she would rather die than get vaccinated.Might just get her wish.
    I laugh at these fools. What exactly do they think they're gonna achieve other than making themselves look like the morons they are .. Everyone knows politicians and governments lie about all sorts of things but in this instance they're a messenger, simply passing/acting on information from the medical authorities. To me it's not so much about trusting government but trusting the information itself. Unlike the garbage the protestors like to carry on with it's actually backed by scientific evidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kelsey86 View Post
    I laugh at these fools. What exactly do they think they're gonna achieve other than making themselves look like the morons they are .. Everyone knows politicians and governments lie about all sorts of things but in this instance they're a messenger, simply passing/acting on information from the medical authorities. To me it's not so much about trusting government but trusting the information itself. Unlike the garbage the protestors like to carry on with it's actually backed by scientific evidence.
    Like by 1000 times............Every freedom protestor should be locked up

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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    Did anyone have side effects for the first shot and not the second ?

    The first one - left me lethargic with a bit of a headache... 2nd one did bugger all.

    2nd one probably a placebo..
    I had Pfizer and was opposite for me. First shot a little sore arm, second shot was Friday lunch time, I spent most of Saturday dealing with flu symptoms, had an arvo nap for 3 hours. Sunday woke up feeling fine.
    Last edited by Toolish; 22nd August 2021 at 08:47 PM.


 

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