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Thread: Scifi's swing

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scifisicko View Post

    The second one by a country mile. The first one is awful.

  2. #27
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    to be clear i mean between the two video swings in post 11...not between the swing in post 1 vs the 1st of the two swings in post 11.
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  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scifisicko View Post
    to be clear i mean between the two video swings in post 11...not between the swing in post 1 vs the 1st of the two swings in post 11.
    OK now I am lost . . .

    I thought the first one in the post 11 was the swing in post 1. righto the second one here, the one with your legs further apart.

    http://www.ozgolf.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=16363

  4. #29
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    Scifi,

    The first swing on post 11 is your best swing by far. In you second swing on post 11, you fired your hips too early and as a result you have cast your club big time.

    Here's comparison on the downswing when the hands are hip high.

    swing 1

    before.jpg



    swing 2
    after.jpg

  5. #30
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    Jono,

    Let me rephase your statement.

    "SciFi, You have more lag angle in your first swing - therefore it is a better swing than the others. I shall ignore everything else"

    Maybe you should also add how "on plane" he is...
    Last edited by virge666; 8th April 2012 at 10:10 AM.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    Jono,

    Let me rephase your statement.

    "SciFi, You have more lag angle in your first swing - therefore it is a better swing than the others. I shall ignore everything else"

    Maybe you should also add how "on plane" he is...
    Don't know what you are on about Virge. Scifi wanted a comparison in his two swings on post 11 and I thought the first swing on post 11 was better than the second swing on post 11 as the hips and arms were really out of sync in the second swing leading to worsening of his cast. Can't say anything about the plane as he didn't show down the line view of his swings on post 11.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono View Post
    Don't know what you are on about Virge. Scifi wanted a comparison in his two swings on post 11 and I thought the first swing on post 11 was better than the second swing on post 11 as the hips and arms were really out of sync in the second swing leading to worsening of his cast. Can't say anything about the plane as he didn't show down the line view of his swings on post 11.
    #1, Because all you are looking at is lag angle. You actually cannot tell if he is casting from a front on camera shot... because if he is releasing on plane - it is just an early release, not casting. (which is fine)

    #2, His entire right side collapses at impact, less lag angle is an advantage

    #3, He flips is right hand under at impact, less lag angle is an advantage.

    #4, His clubface is closed on the backswing and rotating OPEN through impact .... less lag angle is an advantage.

    Sync is not really an option yet as the lower half doesn't rotate at all, it slides... there is nothing for the upper body to sync up with. All you are asking for is better timing for the "flip"

    Once you get the lower half to rotate, you can then get the upper body more over the ball and less behind the ball at impact. This will steepen is attack into the ball and get the right shoulder going down the plane. This will add your lag angle and allow him to release the clubhead, not hold it open to stop the hook.

    In other words - for those not technical, you have to fix the clubface. That is what hits the ball.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    #1, Because all you are looking at is lag angle. You actually cannot tell if he is casting from a front on camera shot... because if he is releasing on plane - it is just an early release, not casting. (which is fine)

    #2, His entire right side collapses at impact, less lag angle is an advantage

    #3, He flips is right hand under at impact, less lag angle is an advantage.

    #4, His clubface is closed on the backswing and rotating OPEN through impact .... less lag angle is an advantage.

    Sync is not really an option yet as the lower half doesn't rotate at all, it slides... there is nothing for the upper body to sync up with. All you are asking for is better timing for the "flip"

    Once you get the lower half to rotate, you can then get the upper body more over the ball and less behind the ball at impact. This will steepen is attack into the ball and get the right shoulder going down the plane. This will add your lag angle and allow him to release the clubhead, not hold it open to stop the hook.

    In other words - for those not technical, you have to fix the clubface. That is what hits the ball.
    Virge, virge, virge ... What you've stated above are absolute bollocks. Serious lack in understanding of cause and result.

    If you care seriously suggesting that his second swing on post 11 is better than the first swing, you need to have your eyes checked. Look at his hips. It's fired so early he's got nothing left to get him across the line.

    It doesn't matter whether you are on plane or not. If you have lost the angle between the club and the left arm, you have cast the club.

    There are many players out there who lag well with closed clubface.

    You can play good golf whilst casting and even some PGA players lose the angle early, but the swing would be more efficient energy wise if you didn't cast.

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    *grabs popcorn*
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  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Puji View Post
    *grabs popcorn*
    I know dude, but I am up for it. Especially with some chopper who plays off 18 and hasn't hit a fairway since John Howard was Prime Minister. Which is rather ironic seeing as Jono is always in the far LEFT.

    But I digress . . .

    Post #10 asks Sci to rotate his lower body like a bastard... and lets see where that gets us. That is all I asked. He did that brilliantly.

    The simple reason being is I have to get his lower body moving... in some way, shape or form. I dont care if it is too much as long as he gets it going. Once Sci gets the feeling of the lower half moving, we can then get it in the right sequence. Or actually, Sci will probably do it himself once he sees the lower and more penetrating flight.

    Jono is right, it is too early, but that is not as bad as it not moving at all. ESPECIALLY with a collapsed right side and massive flip. One step at a time...

    As for cause and effect tripe that he vomits out in every single thread, if he really understood it, he would have other shots in the bag other than the low snap hook with a 47" driver.

    Enjoy.

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    love it.

    Im going to need another bowl...
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  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    I know dude, but I am up for it. Especially with some chopper who plays off 18 and hasn't hit a fairway since John Howard was Prime Minister. Which is rather ironic seeing as Jono is always in the far LEFT.

    But I digress . . .

    Post #10 asks Sci to rotate his lower body like a bastard... and lets see where that gets us. That is all I asked. He did that brilliantly.

    The simple reason being is I have to get his lower body moving... in some way, shape or form. I dont care if it is too much as long as he gets it going. Once Sci gets the feeling of the lower half moving, we can then get it in the right sequence. Or actually, Sci will probably do it himself once he sees the lower and more penetrating flight.

    Jono is right, it is too early, but that is not as bad as it not moving at all. ESPECIALLY with a collapsed right side and massive flip. One step at a time...

    As for cause and effect tripe that he vomits out in every single thread, if he really understood it, he would have other shots in the bag other than the low snap hook with a 47" driver.

    Enjoy.
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  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    I know dude, but I am up for it. Especially with some chopper who plays off 18 and hasn't hit a fairway since John Howard was Prime Minister. Which is rather ironic seeing as Jono is always in the far LEFT.

    But I digress . . .

    Post #10 asks Sci to rotate his lower body like a bastard... and lets see where that gets us. That is all I asked. He did that brilliantly.

    The simple reason being is I have to get his lower body moving... in some way, shape or form. I dont care if it is too much as long as he gets it going. Once Sci gets the feeling of the lower half moving, we can then get it in the right sequence. Or actually, Sci will probably do it himself once he sees the lower and more penetrating flight.

    Jono is right, it is too early, but that is not as bad as it not moving at all. ESPECIALLY with a collapsed right side and massive flip. One step at a time...

    As for cause and effect tripe that he vomits out in every single thread, if he really understood it, he would have other shots in the bag other than the low snap hook with a 47" driver.

    Enjoy.
    Mate, I could get personal and talk about your pretend 280m drives and pretend guru status but the fact of the matter is, the first swing on post 11 is a better swing than the second swing. This is the point you argued. Now you are admitting that "yeah it's out of sync but at least his lower body is moving".


    The problem with Scifi's swing is not his lower body movement. He doesn't know how to use his hands and arms.

  14. #39
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    Here's another comparison.

    sciimpact1.jpg

    sciimpact2.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono View Post
    Mate, I could get personal and talk about your pretend 280m drives and pretend guru status but the fact of the matter is, the first swing on post 11 is a better swing than the second swing. This is the point you argued. Now you are admitting that "yeah it's out of sync but at least his lower body is moving".
    The problem:
    POST #4: You dont use the ground at all and the hands are too early into impact with a massive flip.
    POST #10: The club is shut on the backswing and open on the follow through.

    This is classic no lower body rotation. You can fix it by either getting the student to do clubface drills or exagerate the lower body rotation. IMHO, It is easier on a forum to do the lower body ones. 2am golf lesson anyone ????

    My Solution
    POST #10. you need to rotate you left hip out of the way...

    His Question
    POST 25: would you say i am closer with the first or second swing in post 11?

    My Answer
    POST 26: Your second swing is more like what I asked you to do.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------

    Righto, sorted. Then you come in a confuse the whole thing for the poor bloke and tell him he is clearing his hips too early... which is exactly what I want him to do because he can play like that without any problem and secondly all I have to do after that is get him a bit steeper into impact to give him some lag angle and he is done and dusted. Flip gone, ball flight sorted.

    The problem with Scifi's swing is not his lower body movement. He doesn't know how to use his hands and arms.
    What a bloody stupid statement, they are both connected and changing one will alter the other... You can fix it either way, I chose legs because it is easier to explain on a forum and I can then offer various youtube vids to help the bloke out.

    See the picture below, Sci made that improvement over a weekend... he made those improvements by an exagerated clearing of the hips... how about you not tell him that his fault is an exagerated clearing of the hips... can you do that for me ?

    = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

    For those being entertained by Jono's and my rants... I regard him as a pretty good mate, he hits it miles past me, but I am rather proud of my John Howard and Jono "left" joke. Lastly, I am way more of a pretend golf guru than he is.

    For Sci, to be honest, you picked it up pretty quickly. You went from massive flip to shaft lean in about 6 posts which is brilliant. The change in this picture is just awesome.



    If you want more info on the benefits of lower body rotation, search for the "2AM Golf lesson". It is in this section somewhere. The next post will be some more tripe by Jono, after that I would love to see some more swings from you. Especially down the line so we can all see what the clubface is doing. The next step is what gives you a bit more compression.

    That is my rant over for the evening. I am going back to the Rugby which the Western Force seem to want to lose...

    Enjoy.
    Last edited by virge666; 13th April 2012 at 10:35 PM.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono View Post
    Here's another comparison.

    Attachment 16493

    Attachment 16494

    OK,

    I see where we have a problem... you top picture is my bottom video....

    John,

    We have been arguing over the same thing... Joy.

    Anyone else... Macbook Pro and Lion OS ??
    Last edited by virge666; 13th April 2012 at 10:37 PM.

  17. #42
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    Virge,

    Read post 11 again and then read my post 29.

    Dyslexia is a treatable condition...

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    My Solution
    POST #10. you need to rotate you left hip out of the way...

    His Question
    POST 25: would you say i am closer with the first or second swing in post 11?

    My Answer
    POST 26: Your second swing is more like what I asked you to do.
    You misunderstood Scifi too. He asked you to compare the two swings he put up on post 11. Where has you are talking about his swing in post 1 vs first swing on post 11.

    on post 29, I said that his first swing ON POST 11 was his best swing to date.

    BTW, I still think the best way is to learn how the hands and arms work first which will allow the body to work naturally.
    Last edited by Jono; 13th April 2012 at 11:02 PM.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jono View Post
    You misunderstood Scifi too. He asked you to compare the two swings he put up on post 11. Where has you are talking about his swing in post 1 vs first swing on post 11.

    on post 29, I said that his first swing ON POST 11 was his best swing to date.
    Nope,

    I compared both his swings on that page. I took his screen shot to compare.

    I did exactly what you did and looked at impact. You would have to be a total moron to like that ugly impact position.

    Hence the phase, that first one is bloody awful.


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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    Nope,

    I compared both his swings on that page. I took his screen shot to compare.

    I did exactly what you did and looked at impact. You would have to be a total moron to like that ugly impact position.

    Hence the phase, that first one is bloody awful.

    Ha ha. Great Escape ...

    I'm pretty sure he was talking about the two Youtube vids on post 11, not his still photos.

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    Not enough Zenolink.

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    I'm confused, so you guys are arguing for the same thing with the pictures around the wrong way?

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    Doesn't matter either way. It's piss funny!!


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    Quote Originally Posted by virge666 View Post
    I know dude, but I am up for it. Especially with some chopper who plays off 18 and hasn't hit a fairway since John Howard was Prime Minister. Which is rather ironic seeing as Jono is always in the far LEFT. .
    Oh, them fightin words boy! Lucky you two are mates.

    I enjoy the discussion on swing theory. Not enough of it. Am about to buy my super slo-mo camera to have my swing dissected.

    Jono, what do you mean the working of the arms and hands should be learnt first, then the body? I feel it's the other way around.




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  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppas View Post
    I'm confused, so you guys are arguing for the same thing with the pictures around the wrong way?
    Exactly.

    Quote Originally Posted by matty View Post
    Jono, what do you mean the working of the arms and hands should be learnt first, then the body? I feel it's the other way around.
    You can do it both ways... it usually depends on the student. You get the same kind of problems with both methods.

    If you teach the hands, the student will usually try and close the club face with the right wrist instead of letting the body release the club head.
    If you teach the body, the student will either not rotate enough, or as they rotate stand up on their right foot and hook it.

    On a forum, it is pretty difficult.

    My usual procedure is to get the bloke to spin the lower half until the flip goes, then get them to try and hit low 5-10m cuts to teach the hands how to release. It gets rid of the slide and the hook. The student can implement it without destroying their game and it also teaches path, which is bloody important.

    If you do it with pitching and wedges... you can improve a players game quite quickly.
    Last edited by virge666; 14th April 2012 at 07:20 PM.


 

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