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8th March 2011 01:29 AM
#101
Senior Member
Order of Merit winner
Originally Posted by
Johnny Canuck
I wasn't happy. Deep kack, left side of 9 at KB. We had both hit in, so I was quite happy to go 3 off the tee and play it out.
Technically, yes. You can instantly take it out of play by dropping, not declaring a provisional, and playing another shot.
Give me the initials of the member. I've had a chat with one guy there before about a similar thing.
I dont actually know his last name, only the first. He's only been there for about 8 months or so.
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8th March 2011 01:31 AM
#102
Senior Member
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
Not the same guy then. You see some interesting things out there.
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8th March 2011 01:33 AM
#103
Senior Member
Order of Merit winner
absolutely.
Local rule regarding ball plugged in bunker face etc, etc. The bloke was adamant I had to play it as it lies. Its even got the rule on the scorecard as per rule 22, but he refused to sign the card if I took relief. Thats a name i'll be looking out for.
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8th March 2011 02:40 PM
#104
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
Originally Posted by
Courty
Me too, although I highly recommend downloading the R&A Rules of Golf iPhone App (not sure if you can get it for Android). Very handy whilst on the battlefield!
I got it on the iPhone and it is excellent
Golf is an ineffectual attempt to get an uncontrollable sphere into an inaccessible hole with instruments ill adapted to the purpose
Woods: Titleist 915 D2 10.5*, 915 f15*, 915 h21*
Irons: Titleist 712 AP2 4-PW
Wedges: Titleist SM5 54/10* & 60/7*
Putter: Taylormade Spider Tour Red
Bag: Eagles & Birdies Links
Bugy: Clickgear 3.5
Home Club: Kooringal
Handicap Game Golf
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8th March 2011 02:49 PM
#105
Senior Member
Touring Pro (PGA)
I sent a question to the R&A, apparently they are generating a flash based rules app for mobile devices first then making an android specific version.
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8th March 2011 02:59 PM
#106
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
I had the situation the other day where I chipped my ball to about 18" and one of the guys in my group was to chip next and I thought that there was a good chance that his chip might hit my ball and deflect closer to the hole. I said hang on while I mark my ball, he said leave it as it may help stop his ball. He then chipped before I could get to the ball to mark it. He missed my ball, but my understanding is that I have to mark it (especially as he wanted me to leave it to help him). I reckon rule 22 is pretty clear on it and we had quite a bit of discussion as a group over the next few holes.
Golf is an ineffectual attempt to get an uncontrollable sphere into an inaccessible hole with instruments ill adapted to the purpose
Woods: Titleist 915 D2 10.5*, 915 f15*, 915 h21*
Irons: Titleist 712 AP2 4-PW
Wedges: Titleist SM5 54/10* & 60/7*
Putter: Taylormade Spider Tour Red
Bag: Eagles & Birdies Links
Bugy: Clickgear 3.5
Home Club: Kooringal
Handicap Game Golf
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8th March 2011 03:08 PM
#107
Senior Member
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
You don't have to mark it, but he can't ask you to leave it there either.
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8th March 2011 03:16 PM
#108
Senior Member
Order of Merit winner
Originally Posted by
3oneday
You don't have to mark it, but he can't ask you to leave it there either.
+1. According to rule 22. Auto dis-qualification.
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8th March 2011 03:17 PM
#109
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
I just re-read the rule. If he asks me to leave it there and I agree we can both be disqualified by the Committee, but normally it is a two stroke penalty. But to him or me?
Golf is an ineffectual attempt to get an uncontrollable sphere into an inaccessible hole with instruments ill adapted to the purpose
Woods: Titleist 915 D2 10.5*, 915 f15*, 915 h21*
Irons: Titleist 712 AP2 4-PW
Wedges: Titleist SM5 54/10* & 60/7*
Putter: Taylormade Spider Tour Red
Bag: Eagles & Birdies Links
Bugy: Clickgear 3.5
Home Club: Kooringal
Handicap Game Golf
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8th March 2011 03:23 PM
#110
Senior Member
Order of Merit winner
It would be to him.
By the sounds of it though, you didnt agree to leave it there.He just played it before you got a chance to mark.
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8th March 2011 03:28 PM
#111
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
If he had hit my ball I would have asked that he take a 2 stroke penalty, as it was he got no where near it so it was academic.
Golf is an ineffectual attempt to get an uncontrollable sphere into an inaccessible hole with instruments ill adapted to the purpose
Woods: Titleist 915 D2 10.5*, 915 f15*, 915 h21*
Irons: Titleist 712 AP2 4-PW
Wedges: Titleist SM5 54/10* & 60/7*
Putter: Taylormade Spider Tour Red
Bag: Eagles & Birdies Links
Bugy: Clickgear 3.5
Home Club: Kooringal
Handicap Game Golf
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8th March 2011 04:04 PM
#112
Admin Team
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
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8th March 2011 04:55 PM
#113
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
Originally Posted by
IanO
If he had hit my ball I would have asked that he take a 2 stroke penalty, as it was he got no where near it so it was academic.
You can't enforce a penalty on him for hitting your ball. All that happened is he hit before you were able to mark it, a breach of etiquette, but not a breach of the rules.
Golf Map | WITB: Titleist TSR3 9* / Titleist 917F 3W 13.5* / PING G430 5W 17* / Titleist T100S 4I - PW / Vokey SM9 50-8*, 55-10*, 60-10* / PING Sigma2 Kushin C 35.5" / Titleist ProV1
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8th March 2011 05:36 PM
#114
Senior Member
Order of Merit winner
Similar to something hocko has mentioned before... I played a course onetime (i believe its Kwinana) who had a local rule in effect that 'every shot was to be played as it lies'. Apparently this was due to some members taking ridiculous amounts of relief so they could have perfect lies.
Anyway, my Uncles drive found its way into a grass tree (blackboy tree, whatever you want to call it) and was nestled in there at about waist height. The old guy we were playing with agreed to allow him relief, but the other younger guy (about mid to late 30's) said it was play it as it lies. Even though this would mean playing it from a tree.
What would have been correct in that situation? I would have thought it was an obvious unplayable lie and relief can be taken? and at what point do the official R&A rules 'over-rule' the local rules?
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8th March 2011 05:39 PM
#115
Admin Team
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
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8th March 2011 05:46 PM
#116
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
IMO there are possibly three options available in this scenario:
1. An unplayable lie can be taken - 1 stroke penalty
a) Go back to where last stroke was played
b) Go back on line with ball and flag and drop
c) Drop 2 club lengths from where the ball lay
2. There could possibly have been a local rule for "Ornamental Trees - Staked or Under 2 club lengths in height" - Free relief can be taken
3. Try to play as it lies.
You can declare your ball unplayable at any time (unless in a water hazard) regardless of the local rules. I think in this case the young bloke is taking "Play as it lies" too literally. What if the ball was stuck in a 20m high tree, is he expected to climb it and hit the ball?
Golf Map | WITB: Titleist TSR3 9* / Titleist 917F 3W 13.5* / PING G430 5W 17* / Titleist T100S 4I - PW / Vokey SM9 50-8*, 55-10*, 60-10* / PING Sigma2 Kushin C 35.5" / Titleist ProV1
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8th March 2011 05:49 PM
#117
Site Owner
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
Playing it as it lies didn't stop Happy Gilmore.
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8th March 2011 05:53 PM
#118
Senior Member
Order of Merit winner
Originally Posted by
AndyP
Playing it as it lies didn't stop Happy Gilmore.
we'll try that at the WA champs.
Pieface can be the giant.
Yoss can be happy.
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8th March 2011 07:38 PM
#119
Senior Member
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
Originally Posted by
rubin1909
but he refused to sign the card if I took relief
He is not entitle to refuse to sign your card if he thinks you breached a rule - no matter whether he is right or wrong.
See Definitions, Marker: ..."He is not a referee" and also page 56.
In a nutshell the marker signs to attest that is the score that the competitor said he had. If the marker disagrees he must report this to the committee. If in the case the marker refuses to sign the card because he being a nob, the committee will sign the card for the player anyway. Thus the threat " i will not sign your card" is an empty one.
Originally Posted by
Minor_Threat
All that happened is he hit before you were able to mark it, a breach of etiquette, but not a breach of the rules.
My interpretation is that the player can be disqualified by the committee. Rule 22-1b, i read the last sentence competitors as also meaning competitor.
Originally Posted by
rubin1909
and at what point do the official R&A rules 'over-rule' the local rules?
The Committee cannot modify or waive the rules of golf without approval from the R&A. such actions in extreme circumstances could a club to lose its affiliation and rounds played at such a course could be handicapped.
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Criticism doesn't bother me, as it means I am doing something and people are watching.
Handy-Cap
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8th March 2011 08:04 PM
#120
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
Originally Posted by
markTHEblake
My interpretation is that the player can be disqualified by the committee. Rule 22-1b, i read the last sentence competitors as also meaning competitor.
Having just re-read what IanO posted I have to agree. It seems both players were in agreement that the ball could assist another ball and therefore it should have been marked.
Golf Map | WITB: Titleist TSR3 9* / Titleist 917F 3W 13.5* / PING G430 5W 17* / Titleist T100S 4I - PW / Vokey SM9 50-8*, 55-10*, 60-10* / PING Sigma2 Kushin C 35.5" / Titleist ProV1
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8th March 2011 09:01 PM
#121
Senior Member
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
I just read the Rule 22 decisions, and I am less certain now.
Its also clear there is no penalty if a player asked for a ball to be replaced. Decision 22/5
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Criticism doesn't bother me, as it means I am doing something and people are watching.
Handy-Cap
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8th March 2011 09:05 PM
#122
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
Originally Posted by
markTHEblake
I just read the Rule 22 decisions, and I am less certain now.
Its also clear there is no penalty if a player asked for a ball to be replaced. Decision 22/5
How can another player ask for a ball to be replaced? What reason other than to be of asstance would the player want a ball replaced? I can't see how you can force a player to replace their ball?
Golf Map | WITB: Titleist TSR3 9* / Titleist 917F 3W 13.5* / PING G430 5W 17* / Titleist T100S 4I - PW / Vokey SM9 50-8*, 55-10*, 60-10* / PING Sigma2 Kushin C 35.5" / Titleist ProV1
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8th March 2011 09:15 PM
#123
Senior Member
Golf Hall of Fame Inductee
you will need to read the decision yourself to get it.
How can another player ask for a ball to be replaced?
Asking is not against the rules.
I can't see how you can force a player to replace their ball?
a special blend of psychology and extreme violence would probably work quite well.
--
Criticism doesn't bother me, as it means I am doing something and people are watching.
Handy-Cap
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8th March 2011 09:18 PM
#124
Senior Member
Touring Pro (European Tour)
Originally Posted by
markTHEblake
you will need to read the decision yourself to get it.
Asking is not against the rules.
a special blend of psychology and extreme violence would probably work quite well.
Ahhh ok I get it now. You can ask and not be penalised and the player is nor required to replace to the ball. Is the decisions book available in an online version?
Golf Map | WITB: Titleist TSR3 9* / Titleist 917F 3W 13.5* / PING G430 5W 17* / Titleist T100S 4I - PW / Vokey SM9 50-8*, 55-10*, 60-10* / PING Sigma2 Kushin C 35.5" / Titleist ProV1
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8th March 2011 09:25 PM
#125
Senior Member
Order of Merit winner
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