Presetting the hips?

[edhannan]

I see occasional references, some by Virge666, to "presetting the hips" at address. I'm wondering...
What does it mean?
What is the purpose?
How does one do it?

[razaar]

Welcome to the forum. Setting the hips level, ensuring the bend is in the hips and not at the waist and being conscious of the angle because this angle has to be preserved until the ball has been struck.

[edhannan]

I thought I had posted a reply, but I don't see it. A second try.

Thank you Razaar.
What you describe seems like a conventional, sound set up. I thought that presetting the hips might be a variation from the norm to guide the direction of the turn or to encourage a fuller turn. For example, Virge talks of trying to get his right hip deeper on the backswing.
I was guessing it might be something like the right-foot-back drill, or like Moe Norman's set up where he is already partly into his turn.

[razaar]

Who knows Ed you could be right. Norman started his backswing with his right hip as did Jack Nicklaus and probably countless others including Chad Campbell.
http://www.pgatour.com/swingplex/01/25/10/index.html

The important thing is to fully turn the trunk on full shots and for most people this requires a full turn of the hips, butt pointing to the left heel.

[virge666]

I see occasional references, some by Virge666, to "presetting the hips" at address. I'm wondering...
What does it mean?
What is the purpose?
How does one do it?

This involves closing the hips at setup. It is called "presetting" as you are pre turning the hips before the backswing.

This helps with turning drills and a few other reasons to do with different swing patterns.

[edhannan]

Fellows, thanks for the input.
Virge, I see its potential value for turning drills. Would you favour it as a standard setup for a right-sided swinger? Do you yourself set up with your hips a bit closed?

[virge666]

Fellows, thanks for the input.
Virge, I see its potential value for turning drills. Would you favour it as a standard setup for a right-sided swinger? Do you yourself set up with your hips a bit closed?

My hips are indeed slightly closed - bugger all but just the little bit closed.

I would like to see what you do on the downswing before I offer any advice on the benefits... if you have a look at Zig's swing - I would say NO WAY !!! but with MikeZone13 swing - i would say a definite yes.

Horses for courses.

[edhannan]

Thanks Virge.
I see what you mean re Zig's swing. I can't find Mikezone's. As for my own, I can't seem to find it either at present. I've been working faithfully on an Edwin swing and am committed to it. But too often the progress I make on the practice range gets lost on the way to the first tee.

I suppose that's the way of it for anybody trying to change a lifetime of golf habits

[virge666]

Thanks Virge.
I see what you mean re Zig's swing. I can't find Mikezone's. As for my own, I can't seem to find it either at present. I've been working faithfully on an Edwin swing and am committed to it. But too often the progress I make on the practice range gets lost on the way to the first tee.

I suppose that's the way of it for anybody trying to change a lifetime of golf habits

Close them a touch if your have an GE swing.

[edhannan]

Close them a touch if your have an GE swing.

Thanks Virge. I'm trying your tip, so far with good result. I'm finding the preset makes it easier for me to keep my lower half against the wall on the backswing. In fact, it has led to a kind of "eureka" insight...that the shimmy movement of the hips is not just straight ahead/back (as it appeared to me in Gary Edwin's and Don Fardon's demonstrations). Rather it has a rotational element that I was missing.
A simple change that has dramatic effects.

[razaar]

This involves closing the hips at setup. It is called "presetting" as you are pre turning the hips before the backswing.

This helps with turning drills and a few other reasons to do with different swing patterns.

Virge, I keep coming back to this, need some help to understand what it means.

[zigwah]

My hips are indeed slightly closed - bugger all but just the little bit closed.

I would like to see what you do on the downswing before I offer any advice on the benefits... if you have a look at Zig's swing - I would say NO WAY !!! but with MikeZone13 swing - i would say a definite yes.

Horses for courses.

virge can you please explain why this is a no way for me?

[edhannan]

virge can you please explain why this is a no way for me?

Zigwah, these comments are intended as "in addition to" not "instead of" the excellent instruction Virge is providing to you.

I think that your hips are already overactive in your backswing. And, as Virge pointed out in his last vid and commentary re your swing, you want to quiet them down in the takeaway and aim for some separation or independence between the shoulder turn and the hip turn.

I see some similarities between your top of swing position and my own. I think that neither are very good. The hands get way behind the body. If you draw a perpendicular line from your hands at the top, the line hits the ground behind your heels. Compare where that line is in the top of swing position of the pros. Their hands are not so far back, but more in front of the chest.
I think we get into that unhappy top position by swinging the arms back instead of UP. Check out Steve Bann's explanation here: http://www.golfxtz.com/view_video.ph...9583c34fd356ef
Hank Haney has a similar vid.

From our top of swing position, we can't simply drop our hands into the slot. So the shoulder moves forward to start the downswing...over the top. We never do get the club on plane, and so nearing impact we raise the body (I do that too) to compensate.

First steps, I'd say are to sort out your posture at address and nail down the takeaway. Then, work on hinging the arms up rather than swinging them back. Keep your hands more in front of the chest.

[virge666]

Nice one Ed makes good sense. Zig is just to active and too flat the last thing you want to do have suck the hips in more..

RAZ,

Presetting the hips is a TGM hitting component. Instead of moving the hips back on the back swing, you preset them closed and just lift your arms an drive down.

Good for pitching. and people who dont turn in the rigth direction.

[zigwah]

Nice one Ed makes good sense. Zig is just to active and too flat the last thing you want to do have suck the hips in more..

RAZ,

Presetting the hips is a TGM hitting component. Instead of moving the hips back on the back swing, you preset them closed and just lift your arms an drive down.

Good for pitching. and people who dont turn in the rigth direction.

Now i'm too flat, i'm confused as all get out, i thought i had to flatten my swing out, with my shoulders?

[virge666]

Now i'm too flat, i'm confused as all get out, i thought i had to flatten my swing out, with my shoulders?

No video ???

[Jono]

Virge, I can't remember presetting of the hips as being one of TGM's components ... but then, I suppose TGM is supposed to cover most types of swings.

Raz, have you read any work by late Joe Norwood? He specifically mentions presetting (or preloading) the right hip at set up.

[razaar]

No mate never heard of it. Presetting the hips in a closed position doesn't make any sense to me because the hips need to be in an open position at impact. In fact there are teachers who advocate having the hips in a slightly open position at address to imitate the contact position and to encourage a tighter coil in the backswing. The oldtimers, Locke Hogan Snead & Co recommended pulling the right foot back a few inches but with hips parallel to the target line for draw shots. I tend to follow the advice of the old guys - their methods are well proven and one doesn't have to be an elite athlete.

[virge666]

Virge, I can't remember presetting of the hips as being one of TGM's components ... but then, I suppose TGM is supposed to cover most types of swings.

TGM call it "pre-clearing the right hip" it is to give room to pull the club up like a lawnmower cord. Standard hitting pattern.

Works fine for a driving right arm instead of the hips pulling the arms through.