The Lowdown on Driver Loft and Distance

[markTHEblake]

Golf smith has compiled a bunch of data from some launch monitor test (http://www.golfsmith.com/cm/display_page.php?page_num=cm_lp_mag0508_clubfittin g_tip&ln=N&PHPSESSID=d6477dd4315c34c43fb50fd6fa198895)s, and the results were surprising. even on the higher clubhead speeds the max distances were still achieved using 13deg drivers :shock:

Whilst averages are nice it doesn't mean one should rush out and put a 44" shaft on a 3W, cos everybody is different, but i coulda sworn that such figures would put a high 90's mph swing at around 10deg for optimum distance.

I'm very tempted now to get a LM session done :-)

[leighthebee]

Had a launch session a couple of years ago (Archerfield guys) and was told that anyone not swinging 110mph + (driver swing) should not use a driver less than 11 degrees regardless of swing.

The 11.5 905R with Fuji Speeder Stiff has been in the bag since and I couldn't be happier. I cop crap for carrying a 2 wood from some sources, but what is golf without a little sledging.

[Webster]

There is nothing really new in that research, however it would have been good to see the results where the swing speeds were around 110-115mph. Vanity and ego prevent most players accepting the truth that they would play better with a 12-14 degree driver.

[lucky]

I was surprised to see Lorena Ochoa using a 7.5 degree driver at the Michelob

[PeteyD]

Would be better if it was easier to get a higher loft driver. No one on here sells em and retail is not an option ;)

[Grunt]

Getting a LM session done today, could result in Grunt getting a new driver too.

[BrisVegas]

it still weirds me out that you speak of grunt in the 3rd person...

[PeteyD]

"The Grunt likes what he sees ..."

[Moe Norman]

I'd get a higher loft driver if I didn't send my 8.5* into orbit already

[Webster]

thats because you don't swing the club properly Moe..

[3oneday]

thats because you don't swing the club properly Moe..that's what I have always thought, go to a higher lofted driver so it teaches you to swing properly. Sadly I can't do it for more than a week before I get frustrated.

[miro]

Ok let me be the voice of argument.

I think these results are rubbish. Whilst true in a simulator they do not hold in the real world. In my opinion the vast number of reasonable golfers (who can strike the ball somewhat squarely) would benefit from lower lofts than now being recommended to benefit from roll. For example the Wife (10 marker) has two identical FT3's (same shaft, same head configuration etc) with the only difference being loft. One a 12 degree, one a 10 degree. She is probably at least 10 metres longer with the 10 degree driver than the 12 degree due to the flatter ball flight and greater roll.

I understand that the new frontier of drivers is not "launch angle" rather it is the anlge at which the ball is landing as this in fact is a major factor in maximising total distance.

The only people these relatively high lofted drivers belong is in the bag of Grunt etc who needs the loft to straighten out his ball flight and Pro's who hit the ball a f..ken mile and don't want it to roll when it lands too much.

[markTHEblake]

Would be better if it was easier to get a higher loft driver. No one on here sells em and retail is not an option ;)

whenever i look at the specs of drivers, the over 10deg ones are always closed. last thing i need is a closed driver :roll:

unless the higher launch angles negate that but i woouldnt think so.

[PeteyD]

There are a couple of Sumos in flea bay at the moment. ...

[3oneday]

13° on 3 balls, senior flex shaft in one as well :p

:lol:

[markTHEblake]

There are a couple of Sumos in flea bay at the moment. ...

I'd become a scientologist before getting one of those.

[Scottt]

I'd become a scientologist before getting one of those.

a Sumo? Why?

[PeteyD]

R7 Draw as well. Not much good for you though Blakey

[3oneday]

I'd become a scientologist before getting one of those.


a Sumo? Why?
cause it's not made outa wood.

[virge666]

Bit of warning about LM's as I own one. Temp and conditions play a HUGE part in what club you choose.

In NSW my 19 degree 5 wood - goes 207-215m, at the glades last week - it went 235m. Take it to Arizona and it goes further again. You can launch at 15 degrees in the USA and it just goes forever.

Most of our LM data is based on USA standards . . . I like to bring it down 2 degrees from what the LM says to get a better number. Also - the BALL makes a HUGE amount of difference. And I mean a ****en HUGE amount.

I did a lot of work on this kind of thing back on ISG, and I found that the big advantage in extra loft is the accuracy. Fairways vs trees. And I still take my 13 degree X flex out when i play matchplay, it just always keeps the ball in play.

Should have used it a Cabramatta yesterday... <sigh>

[lucky]

Surely the type of shaft is a major factor as well. More loft with a firm tipped shaft would be ok but there is no way I would want more loft with a soft tipped shaft.

[Bruce]

Does that then match up with the average chopper's predilection for using shafts that are too stiff for them?

[jimandr]

I can be the voice of experience here, and tell you that golf is not played on a launch monitor.

A few NSW Ozgolfers have seen me wield my 11.5 degree Hi Bore on the course. For me, it looks good, feels great, is the straightest driver I've ever hit, BUT IT GOES NOWHERE.

I'm a short hitter, and really can't afford to lose distance. It looks great to float the driver 200m down the guts, but terrible when it rolls 1 metre after it hits the ground. Mishits struggle to go better than 160 carry, and still don't roll. The only way I can get any real distance out of it is to hit a big rolling hook, and I'm not good enough to hit them consistently.

I've put it back in the garage for the moment and gone back to my Mizuno MP1, which definitely goes further when adding the roll to the carry distance.

[virge666]

A few NSW Ozgolfers have seen me wield my 11.5 degree Hi Bore on the course. For me, it looks good, feels great, is the straightest driver I've ever hit, BUT IT GOES NOWHERE.


1. It is NOT played on a launchy - but even the worse Launchy is more accurate than a good golfer . . . :lol: and it is all we have . . really.

and part 2.
Let's look at the logic of the situation

45" 10degree driver goes XXXm
42.5" 15 degree 3 wood goes less than XXXm

so a 45" 13 degree driver goes in between that number with a touch more forgiveness from the larger head.

If there is any difference to this equation - then you have not been fitted correctly by the sales guy or forum seller ;)

[markTHEblake]

It looks great to float the driver 200m down the guts, but terrible when it rolls 1 metre after it hits the ground.

Perhaps you are exaggerating a little ;-) cos I would think that is impossible unless the ground is so wet that your drives are almost plugging :lol:

I have always held the view that the higher ball goes further even after roll, cos no ball comes down vertical. (Perhaps that is an old fashioned view)

If the fairways are hard, the high ball bounces too :-)

[Grunt]

Have to back Jim up on this one, when he played the aforementioned driver it seemed to come off the clubface great only to see it a good 25-40m behind mine. I don't hit it that well.

[miro]

Amen Jim I made the same post earlier in the thread. Lower lofts with run for mid markers with relatively square contact is the way to go. REality is not a lauch monitor.

[Webster]

The obsession of most here with distance instead of accuracy off the tee is probably what is holding back your games. You should all be preapred to sacrifice 20 metres off the tee if it means that you are hitting a much higher proportion of fairways. Getting the ball consistently into play off the tee is critical in acheiving the most from your limited ability.

[3oneday]

I don't recall you ever being this condescending when you were off 4, is that what playing off 2 does ?

You should probably email your thoughts to Tiger and friends on the PGA Tour, they hit it so far that they usually only have to reply on their shortgames.

Am I comparing myself to a Tour Player ? No, but it's common sense that if I have an 8 iron in my hands from the rough I am still more likely to hit the green than with a 4 iron from the fairway.

You're wrong, put simply.

[Courty]

Common sense tells me not to get involved in this one, but...


No, but it's common sense that if I have an 8 iron in my hands from the rough I am still more likely to hit the green than with a 4 iron from the fairway.

What about from the trees waaay left? :p

[3oneday]

What about from the trees waaay left? :pI know how to get out of left trees, and trees left of the left trees... takes years of practice :lol:

[Webster]

3oneday,

Since when did telling the truth mean I am condescending?

Do you only hit your 4 iron 20 metres further than your 8? You must be using shafts that are too stiff for you.

[kpac]

Fair comment by jack about sacrificing 20m for better accuracy. I'd do that in a heartbeat, but i've not found a higher loft driver more accurate..... Main reason the current driver is hard to shift out of the bag is it's the most forgivingly accurate driver i've found, find me one that's straighter and i'll take it regardless of loft or length...

[3oneday]

Nice copout.

I need 3 iron to hit a fairway, none of my woods do it :lol:

[Webster]

Nice copout.

I need 3 iron to hit a fairway, none of my woods do it :lol:

thats cos they dont have enough loft!

[3oneday]

Or that my swing is out of whack, or that I don't trust where it is going. The loft argument is lost on me, I'll bow out due to lack of interest.

[Webster]

The loft argument is lost on me, I'll bow out due to lack of interest.

And here I was thinking you were a bit cleverer than most.

"More loft means more accuracy and little if any loss of distance"

[Scottt]

I know how to get out of left trees, and trees left of the left trees... takes years of practice :lol:

Must be Windsor that does that. Due to playing my junior golf at that tree-lined place I am more accurate hooking a low 4 iron through a three-metre-wide gap in the trees than I am with a wedge in my hand 100m out in the fairway :lol:

[miro]

And here I was thinking you were a bit cleverer than most.

"More loft means more accuracy and little if any loss of distance"

Jack that is what Jim and I are saying:

More loft = more accuracy but LESS distance. This is contrary to launch monitors and was the point of the thread not the accuracy argument.

[Webster]

I disagree - I don't believe more loft means less distance, because you get more carry. Especially important down here this time of year.

[Rusty]

... but i coulda sworn that such figures would put a high 90's mph swing at around 10deg for optimum distance.

I'm very tempted now to get a LM session done :-)

i can't recommend LM sessions enough. but not just one - do 2, a week apart. to see if there are any differences over the 2 times. but yeah, ball will make a difference too.

ya can't just look at the numbers alone though. pity it's not that easy. gotta look at the flight also, & what sort of flight do you want.

then hit with the made up driver for a while to see if you can adjust shape and height.

ya right though, contrary to the launch & spin numbers that should give the max distance, my 98mph definitely goes the furtherest with 9.5° loft. the weird part is, it comes out at about 9° with 4k spin :smt102 no where near the ideal.

[v205]

LM doesn't take into account the behaviour of the flight due to wind, is that correct?

For the high loft driver users, doesn't playing into the wind make the driver feel like hitting a wedge?

[BJL82]

i can't recommend LM sessions enough. but not just one - do 2, a week apart. to see if there are any differences over the 2 times. but yeah, ball will make a difference too.

ya can't just look at the numbers alone though. pity it's not that easy. gotta look at the flight also, & what sort of flight do you want.

then hit with the made up driver for a while to see if you can adjust shape and height.

ya right though, contrary to the launch & spin numbers that should give the max distance, my 98mph definitely goes the furtherest with 9.5° loft. the weird part is, it comes out at about 9° with 4k spin :smt102 no where near the ideal.

Different launch meters would be a good idea too

[oz]

I had an 11.5* Titty J once.... man, that was one sweet driver. I didn't feel that I lost much distance (if any), and I hit it very, very straight. Hmmmm... i kinda regret hoing it away now....

[virge666]

LM doesn't take into account the behaviour of the flight due to wind, is that correct?

For the high loft driver users, doesn't playing into the wind make the driver feel like hitting a wedge?


Yeah - any LM will account for wind and temperature and ball type.

[Jono]

Golf smith has compiled a bunch of data from some launch monitor test (http://www.golfsmith.com/cm/display_page.php?page_num=cm_lp_mag0508_clubfittin g_tip&ln=N&PHPSESSID=d6477dd4315c34c43fb50fd6fa198895)s, and the results were surprising. even on the higher clubhead speeds the max distances were still achieved using 13deg drivers :shock:

Whilst averages are nice it doesn't mean one should rush out and put a 44" shaft on a 3W, cos everybody is different, but i coulda sworn that such figures would put a high 90's mph swing at around 10deg for optimum distance.

I'm very tempted now to get a LM session done :-)

I see that they used Vector. It typically advises you to get too much loft. Nothing to do with elevations or conditions setting. It's a fault in the program and how it calculates distance.

Only thing that the Vector is useful for is comparing the ball speed, trajectory, and the backspin between different drivers. The calculated distance is of little use.

If you have your driver and you tend to say balloon it, you can use the Vector to find a driver with less backspin.

The most accurate launch monitor in the market at the moment from all the reports I've heard, is the Trackman. Costs over 10 times the price of a Vector but much much more accurate.