A question about drivers ...

[Stuart]

If you hit a ball right off the 'sweet spot' on modern drivers, do you find that they are all roughly equal in distance (taking into account shaft variation, wind conditions, fairway run etc)?

Reason I ask, is that I have yet to find another driver that can equal my old Ping i15 8degree driver for total distance on 'nutted' drives. Admittedly, it has a sweet spot the size of a pea, but I've hit that driver further on every (par 4 and 5) hole on my local course than anything else since then. Also hit it further into the scrub than most others, but that is another story for another time ...

I did some comparisons over the weekend in the practice nets, and compared the ball speed from my Ping against a similarly shafted Callaway XR and Taylor Made R1. Using foot spray to note the impact point, I only counted balls that were close to dead centre hits, and the Ping was consistently providing about 5kms greater ball speed with comparatively similar average swing speeds. The XR and R1 were pretty much identical.

If all modern drivers are at (or near to) the "max" allowable, why should one provide consistently more ball speed on centre strikes? I can understand that more 'forgiving' drivers may result in longer distances on mis-hits, but I would have thought that a 'middled' shot should work out fairly similarly in terms of ball speed. For what its worth, I have tried another Ping i15 driver, and it provided very similar in results to my own, so I don't think that I just got a 'hot' driver.

[JoeS]

If you are talking about a quality driver and not one of the cheaper $200 types,then I don't see too much difference in length.I am currently gaming the titliest 915 d3 9.5 set at B2.On Friday I drove well,averaged 227 with it.That is 1 metre longer than my mizuno jpx800 that I used around there at christmas.I am yet to game a callaway,but my screen numbers for the mizuno jpx900 looked a bit longer

[Courty]

I'm no expert by any stretch, but I wonder if something about that particular model driver suits your specific launch conditions more than some others?

[Daves]

There is a tolerance allowed for manufacturing variances. Sometimes a driver might be slightly on the positive side and perform a little better than the average. Though 5kph is probably at the extreme for any tolerance variance.

The other factor that I find helps with squeezing out distance, is a spin rate match to your swing characteristics.

[Stuart]

Thanks for the thoughts.

Would spin rate or launch angle have any impact on initial ball speed though? I can definitely see a difference in overall distance as a result of these factors, but I was a bit surprised to see the quite large difference in ball speed alone.

[JADO75]

Smash factor too

[Daves]

Thanks for the thoughts.

Would spin rate or launch angle have any impact on initial ball speed though? I can definitely see a difference in overall distance as a result of these factors, but I was a bit surprised to see the quite large difference in ball speed alone.

Other factors affecting ball speed would include head weight and shaft match and length. You didn't mention comparative launch angles?, but everyone also has an optimal launch angle as well. Stated loft isn't always a good guide to how they launch either.

[Jazz18]

Thanks for the thoughts.

Would spin rate or launch angle have any impact on initial ball speed though? I can definitely see a difference in overall distance as a result of these factors, but I was a bit surprised to see the quite large difference in ball speed alone.

Absolutely. Lower launching clubs will typically have higher ball speeds. Lower spin will also lend itself to higher ball speeds for a longer portion of ball flight. I've always believed the i15 to be one of the longest, if not the longest drivers I've hit too and the one you've got obviously fits your swing really well. They are very low spin. I love mine but just don't game it much cause I like a bit more forgiveness.

[Stuart]

Thanks all - appreciate the input. I was wondering why I was seeing those results, but it does make sense when I think about it.

[TheNuclearOne]

What shafts, lengths and swingweights Stuart?

[Johnny Canuck]

Thanks all - appreciate the input. I was wondering why I was seeing those results, but it does make sense when I think about it.

I always thought my old 9015D was longer than anything else I've own. Same thing as your driver, tiny sweet spot that you could hardly ever find.

[Iain]

I always thought my old 9015D was longer than anything else I've own. Same thing as your driver, tiny sweet spot that you could hardly ever find. I wonder if the smaller sweetspot means there's more energy transferred to the ball when you actually hit the sweetspot.

[Jerrymoo]

The i15 was a very hot driver.

I played one ~2009/2010 for about 1 year... still holds my personal long mark on 2 or 3 holes at my home club, and this is with a couple hundred rounds and multiple drivers since then.

[Daves]

I always thought my old 9015D was longer than anything else I've own. Same thing as your driver, tiny sweet spot that you could hardly ever find.


I wonder if the smaller sweetspot means there's more energy transferred to the ball when you actually hit the sweetspot.

There must be something in it because the Cobra Pro D was another that was noticeably longer if you caught its tiny sweet spot.

[Iain]

There must be something in it because the Cobra Pro D was another that was noticeably longer if you caught its tiny sweet spot. Was it the TM Superdeep that had that reputation too?

[spanner039]

An 8* i15 will be incredibly low spin

If you have the swing speed and a + AOA to launch the thing almost nothing will be longer even in this day and age

SLDR and the Beams would be about the only ones i can think of that would come close, spin wise

[Stuart]

An 8* i15 will be incredibly low spin

If you have the swing speed and a + AOA to launch the thing almost nothing will be longer even in this day and age

SLDR and the Beams would be about the only ones i can think of that would come close, spin wise

When I was first fit into that club, the Ping fitter did say that I was the first person he had come across with that exact setup.

I guess that I have been fluctuating back and forth over the years between a desire for longer drivers (usually lower spin drivers) and something that hits the fairway I am aiming for more often than not (more forgiving drivers, but which have higher spin). The Callaway XR is undoubtedly straighter than the Ping, but on course it is around 20 metres behind (some carry and some roll-out) on equivalent strikes. The question of whether you are better off in the fairway or 20 metres ahead in the rough is a valid one, but equally, I hit my low spin 3 wood (Tour Edge Exotics) only about 5-10 metres behind the Callaway, and more accurately.

I have a Cobra King Ltd Pro head on the way (courtesy of Scarfie) as I have read that it is forgiving lower-spin driver. The search goes on ...

[spanner039]

When I was first fit into that club, the Ping fitter did say that I was the first person he had come across with that exact setup.

I guess that I have been fluctuating back and forth over the years between a desire for longer drivers (usually lower spin drivers) and something that hits the fairway I am aiming for more often than not (more forgiving drivers, but which have higher spin). The Callaway XR is undoubtedly straighter than the Ping, but on course it is around 20 metres behind (some carry and some roll-out) on equivalent strikes. The question of whether you are better off in the fairway or 20 metres ahead in the rough is a valid one, but equally, I hit my low spin 3 wood (Tour Edge Exotics) only about 5-10 metres behind the Callaway, and more accurately.

I have a Cobra King Ltd Pro head on the way (courtesy of Scarfie) as I have read that it is forgiving lower-spin driver. The search goes on ...

20m ahead every time!!!! hitting fairways is overrated

[BUSHY]

I'm no expert by any stretch, but I wonder if something about that particular model driver suits your specific launch conditions more than some others?

That's my take on it. Although not sure if that model comes after the COR restrictions came into play?

[Matt 3 Jab]

Now to find a i15 😂

[Stuart]

Now to find a i15 

Funnily enough, I have just re-added the i15 back into the bag (for the nth time). Going to test it against the Cobra King Ltd Pro today and see how that goes.

[okitoki]

I have an old Ping Zing 2 driver, and the head is tiny... probably just slightly bigger than my hybrids (well, feels like it)
It was great when you can hit it... i remember it used to make a nice ping sound and was a low to mid launcher, and would runs pretty far in dry condition...

but damn, it is not forgiving at all... a miss hit for me back then was a bad duck hook... still have it, and might try to see if I can hit it again :)

[oldracer]

Isn't that the definition of insanity.....

[okitoki]

Isn't that the definition of insanity.....

only if you acknowledge it :)

[Stuart]

Isn't that the definition of insanity.....

Only if the same result is actually worse than the new result.

I think we are all looking for the 'magic' club that fixes our inherent flaws (my biggest one simply being I am crap at golf), and I think that the older clubs (last five years or so) are likely to be no worse than current versions in terms of distance, if they are fitted well with a suitable shaft. I fluctuate back and forth between seeking pure distance outcomes (i15) and something more forgiving (pretty much every other driver in history) for when my swing is off. The i15 clearly suits my swing flaws (high spin, high trajectory, a noted propensity towards hooks) well. But if I am not swinging well, it simply goes all over the shop.

And so, I am off to trial the King Ltd Pro.

[Stuart]

OK, a bit of an update.

I had the course to myself a few times this week (pretty miserable conditions with drizzle, wind of 30kms and a temp of about 10 degrees) and hit two balls off each tee - one with the Ping i15 and one with the Cobra King Ltd Pro. On pure shots, the i15 was slightly longer into the wind, but the Ltd Pro was longer downwind. I would assume that the Ltd Pro is higher spin, but certainly not as much as most other clubs I have tried. However, the big difference was in mishits - bad swings with the Ltd Pro left me either on the edge of the fairway or just into the trees, while the i15 resulted in me either having to chip out sideways or re-loading altogether.

I haven't heard too much chat about the Cobra, but it has genuinely surprised me. I know that there is a honeymoon period with any club, but this is the first one that has both challenged the i15 for distance while still being (relatively) forgiving. Time to finally bench the i15 permanently.

[Stuart]

After a month and the honeymoon is still going - Cobra King Ltd Pro is a really great driver head. Not sure why it doesn't have more buzz about it.

[TheNuclearOne]

The LTD's had loads of buzz on WRX. Very pop over there.

[Stuart]

I don't fit into WRX too well, as my driver speed is pitifully low at around 105mph. All wrxers seem to swing at 120+ ...

[TheNuclearOne]

Just subtract 15mph off all claims :D

[Stuart]

Some of their distance claims are astonishing, in fact they seem to break the laws of physics. Not sure how they average 300 yards of carry off the tee with 100mph swings. Boy, they get defensive if you dare to question them though ...

[petethepilot]

I would top myself if I hit it 300 ....and played off 16 hcp!

[PeteyD]

Maybe they all play at altitude, downwind and with elevated tees ;)

[wazamac]

I'm ecstatic if I hit 220m.