Network Switches - advice please...

[BrisVegas]

I need to install a 24 port ethernet switch in my house, to share an ADSL connection. All advice gratefully accepted.

P.S. I'm no techie (as davemason will attest) but I can "punch-down" with the best of them!

Is there any reason to buy a "name brand" for these things? I would have thought they'd be pretty straightforward with no frills etc needed...

Anyone got one? Any brands to avoid? Any reason why I shouldn't buy the cheapest one? Anyone know of a cheaper deal in Brisbane???

umart (http://www.umart.com.au/newindex2.phtml?bid=2)
Zyxel ES-124P 24 Ports Desktop 10/100 Swich - $139
D-Link DES-1024D 24 Port Switch - $159
Netgear FS524 24 Ports 10/100 Switch - $259

[Moe Norman]

why on earth do you need 24 ports??

[BrisVegas]

why on earth do you need 24 ports??

It's a long story which invloves a 1000 foot roll of CAT 6 cable and an over-zealous first home builder.....

[Moe Norman]

yeah mate, but unless you're planning on networking 24 machines - it's overkill.

hell, 10 ports is overkill.

You should be able to pick one up for less than $50 on the OCAU forums. you can use my account if need be as there are trading restrictions on new members.

[Fishman Dan]

Dion - a NetGear switch will do the job for you, couple of hundred bux from Harris Technology or something.

Unless you've got a number of servers across a number of swiches across a number of networks, your switch will do no more than a standard hub (there is a difference ;)).

[Stoney]

Dion, I have recently done a bit of this work at home. Give me a call and I will talk you through it. Stoney

[connico]

anyone of the ones you have listed will do, it doesnt really matter, a switch is as switch unless your running servers and will be suffereing major network transfers...then i can sell you a used cisco or nortel switch...

but if you get a switch..

you will need..a router that will share the adsl..that has a dhcp server running so computers can connect to it to get internet...but i assume you have that already :) if you require more details then just pm me

[BrisVegas]

anyone of the ones you have listed will do, it doesnt really matter, a switch is as switch....

that's what I was thinking...


you will need..a router that will share the adsl..that has a dhcp server running so computers can connect to it to get internet...but i assume you have that already :)

I've got an ADSL modem and 4-port Router. It runs DHCP, pretty sure. I was planning to feed the signal from one of the ports on the ADSL router into the switch. I'm already sending two of the ports to other rooms in the house via fly-lead "jumpers" back in the hub. I'd like to be able to have all the ports in the house ready to go all the time (hence the 24 port switch), rather than having to manually patch to the room I want to use the internet in each time...

[Moe Norman]

oh I see, you want to be portable in the house with the laptop without being wireless.

to throw a spanner in the works, I'd suggest that the wireless option would actually be cheaper.

Having said that, instead of making alternative suggestions, in regards to the switch. Second hand if you want to save money, as these things go pretty cheap.

[BrisVegas]

Thommo, we'll be upgrading to a newer ADSL2+ modem/4 port router eventually and will get a wireless model to make life easier with the laptops. We've got computers in several rooms (homestays) and for now we can put up with the short LAN cable runs from the various ports in the bedrooms, living areas, decks, courtyard etc.... The cable's there, i wanna use it!

Eventually, i'd like to have a decent media server (HTPC) setup at the hub to be able to serve videos to the various rooms. For now, the cabling is overkill, but it gives me plenty of options down the track...

[Choppa]

DK,

Just buy the cheapest nastiest router they have. A mentioned you don't really need a switch and they will be slightly dearer. Your ADSL modem takes care of all the "cool" stuff you need to do, so get the cheapest thing you can find, you can't go wrong.

[connico]

Thommo, we'll be upgrading to a newer ADSL2+ modem/4 port router eventually and will get a wireless model to make life easier with the laptops.....The cable's there, i wanna use it!

Eventually, i'd like to have a decent media server (HTPC) setup at the hub to be able to serve videos to the various rooms. For now, the cabling is overkill, but it gives me plenty of options down the track...


If your plan sounds pretty sounds, should be ok to run normal network usage from any switch. sounds like you have a pretty large house. If the cabling is already there then i would use it. Wireless might be bit cheaper but if its a large house and has two levels or more, a normal home wireless antenna would not cut the mustard, the single drop will be huge, so he'll have to invest in wireless signal enhancers or a second or third wireless antenna. Esp if the house is double brick and has excellent insulation.

Regardless if your going to use HTPC in the future then i would suggest in a better than average home use 24 port switch and router. If a highlevel of traffic is going to be continously passing the switch and router, they will eventually overheat causing alot of latency, but thats if your using all 24 ports and pushing the switch and router to limits. Just a though thats all. Ie buy a good switch if your concerned that you might be using all 24 ports at one time and trasfering video feeds.

[BrisVegas]

won't ever be using more than 3 or 4 ports at a time i'd imagine. There's only 11 points in the house, I just ran double cables to all points, hence the need for a big switch. I figured it would give me options later.

The house is 3 levels and steel frame with stacks of insulation. I've heard that steel interferes with wireless and would possibly need more repeaters etc.. Also, 3 out of 4 computers in the house are not wireless capable, so would be up for the cost of wireless antenna's for each of them.

[connico]

DK,

Just buy the cheapest nastiest router they have. A mentioned you don't really need a switch and they will be slightly dearer. Your ADSL modem takes care of all the "cool" stuff you need to do, so get the cheapest thing you can find, you can't go wrong.


Routers are important, they handle all the dhcp and the security on your network, you dont want a cheap nasty router doing the job because if someone like me wants to hack your system or your homestays are downloading massive amounts of porn..or you might be...your routers gonna choke and die. You want to rely on your router to keep you netconnection up and running and manual features such as nat, firewall protection, intruder logging, remote command included in better than average gives you better control of your system. Say if you want your homestays to not download stuff you can block the ports necessary....

Cheap routers are a waste of time in the long run...a cheap switch is another issue...cheap switchs are ok, but make sure your getting a switch not a freaking hubs...there are major differences in proformance.

[connico]

won't ever be using more than 3 or 4 ports at a time i'd imagine. There's only 11 points in the house, I just ran double cables to all points, hence the need for a big switch. I figured it would give me options later.

The house is 3 levels and steel frame with stacks of insulation. I've heard that steel interferes with wireless and would possibly need more repeaters etc.. Also, 3 out of 4 computers in the house are not wireless capable, so would be up for the cost of wireless antenna's for each of them.


Looks like your not as computer illiterate as you say you are, your pretty well informed and everything should run smoothly, let us know the results when they are done.

[BrisVegas]

righto you geeks..... slow down!

Given that my adsl modem has a router/switch already.... what do i need? I just want to share an internet connection around a bunch of ports in the house with a single feed from my adsl/modem/router "thingy"...

use simple words please....

[connico]

Ok well since you already have a router, that thing that does your dhcp and your internet connection sharing your pretty much set. It prob has like 4 ports...

Get a switch...a 24port one, it should have a seperate uplink port which you plug a cat45 cable to connect it with your router...any free lan port on the router/modem

Most switchs have an uplink line, just make sure thats green or orange, if its orange its working at 10mbits if its green its operating on both 10/100mbits..

Thats it really, all your network connections should go into the switch then, while you can use the routers spare ports if you have any. :)

Also find out what ip addressing your router uses too..just in case you have to manually give IPs to visitors.

[peter_rs]

BV your prices for the D-link & netgear is good.

you are right on the wireless. we need one on each level at our office and you still get low signals. plus land line is so much faster.

Just go with a 24 port switch and your 4 port router will do the rest. we run 3 24 port switch of a 4 port router at work, the other point is used for wireless access.

I would go the Dlink.

[BrisVegas]

Ok well since you already have a router, that thing that does your dhcp and your internet connection sharing your pretty much set. It prob has like 4 ports...

Get a switch...a 24port one, it should have a seperate uplink port which you plug a cat45 cable to connect it with your router...any free lan port on the router/modem

Most switchs have an uplink line, just make sure thats green or orange, if its orange its working at 10mbits if its green its operating on both 10/100mbits..

Thats it really, all your network connections should go into the switch then, while you can use the routers spare ports if you have any. :)

Also find out what ip addressing your router uses too..just in case you have to manually give IPs to visitors.

Excellent, as I thought. All I need is a switch. When i wired up the study, I made sure I ran three cables to it. One from the router to the switch and then two back from the switch to the two computers in the study. And yes, I'll have a couple of spare ports on the adsl modem.


I think a fellow ozgolfers has helped me out with a switch now too, so it's all good.

Thanks again uber-nerds!

[Bruce]

With all these cables BV - how do they come together? Presumably you have some sort of star topography where all the cables lead to a single point. How do they end at that point? Male? Female? Some or patch panel?

The short answer is you need to connect these ends into your switch/router.
Networking is a doddle these days.

[BrisVegas]

With all these cables BV - how do they come together? Presumably you have some sort of star topography where all the cables lead to a single point. How do they end at that point? Male? Female? Some or patch panel?

star topography - yes
male ends - yes

I also star wired the phones and COAX antenna cables back to the same hub and ran speaker, DVI and component cabling for a future home theatre....

i figured you only get the chance to do this stuff during framing, so I went a little silly. Might take me years to afford/install all the gear to take advantage of this infrastructure...

[connico]

lol isnt it nice designing you own home?? :)

When i contracted my cabling services out to a few builders at one time in my life, I had the ability to custom design the cabling for a very large house. 3 story monster in the eastern suburbs. Regardless i put data, cables to every room and coax and component cables to every room. In the end each room was wired to run speakers, and tv from a central location has a hard data port and also a wireless antenna in each room.

The 2 awesome things that well see in the future with the setup that i prepared is that the guy was a bit of a greenie, so in conjuction with the electrican we wired the house up with solar panels that would power most of the components. He would have the speakers also wired to motion detectors so that they would turn on and switch off when he walked to and from rooms..was pretty cool

[Choppa]

Jesus, people are trying to wire your house up to run an IT business......switch is the buzz word of this thread :roll:

I think you probably need a UPS and SAN as well Vegas...

[Moe Norman]

everyone here has been extremely helpful, if you need serious expert advice PM JJJ on ISG.

He does this stuff on a massive scale for a living.

[AndyP]

What's wrong with our Private Messaging facility......?

[Fishman Dan]

Who needs expert advice ffs, he's connecting a computer to the internet, in any one of (what i can figure out) 24 rooms!

[markTHEblake]

What is it with forums? a man asked about buying a switch and he gets all kinds of other suggestions :roll:


It's a long story which invloves a 1000 foot roll of CAT 6 cable and an over-zealous first home builder.....
:smt046 I have got this mental picture of you standing in front of your switch scratching your head cos you have got one port lit up that you have no effing idea whats connected to it.

Regarding the switch For petes sake your not running anything mission critical right? (what Fish said, first sensible thing he has said all year) Go to www.umart.com.au (http://www.umart.com.au) and buy something with lots of pretty lights, and post a pic of your wiring closet when your finished please!

about wireless, i have a steel framed house. The steel is supposed to attenuate the signal which is bad. However it works for me - though the signal is weaker in the rooms where i need to transmit too (relative to a normal house), but it does pass through 3 walls to get there so i figure that is an awesome result.

if you have any more questions about home/office cabling/networking, this guy is the man,
http://www.ozcableguy.com/
Well known throughout the nerd circles as the pre-eminent networking dude in the country (brisvegas based). Some great articles here about home cabling, not that you need it now that you have already done your grunt work. but if you want real advice regarding what switch to buy, pay his price for it.

anyway smart move pre-wiring your house. well done.

[connico]

yeha ozcableguy is pretty cool, his not a bad sort of bloke and knows his ****.. :P

[BrisVegas]

Thanks Blakey. I was quite proud of myself for managing to wire up this whole house all by myself with just a cordless drill, a holesaw bit and a big bag of plastic insulators for the holes... It was fun!

It was almost as much fun as insulating EVERY internal and external wall and the ceiling with itchy f$#%îng Insulco batts.

[markTHEblake]

are you saying you didnt put wall plates in - how dodgy. I did my old house and i am sure the new resident still doesnt have a clue what all those wall plates are for. there was at least 10 in my office :-)

did you prewire while the house was being built or after it was finished. i want to do a cable run but its a pain with steel frames.

[connico]

if you want effective expandibility then putting cable tunneling around the house is the go :) thats what i got

[BrisVegas]

are you saying you didnt put wall plates in - how dodgy.

No, I put wall plates (brackets) onto the frame everywhere that I wanted speaker and data outlets. You're right, sorry. I also used a box of wall plate brackets and screws. I simply star-wired the cables from the hub out to the plates and left a couple of feet of cable hanging out through the brackets so the plasterers would know where to pull it through the gyprock. They only missed a couple... Annoyingly, they sheeted over my 6th speaker outlet (centre-rear) in the ceiling of the home theatre. It is double-sheeted with Soundcheck plaster board, so it's gonna be a challenge to find that wire if I ever need to go 6.1 surround...



did you prewire while the house was being built or after it was finished. i want to do a cable run but its a pain with steel frames.
during construction, after the frame went up and the electricians had done the power/phone/tv wiring.... I couldn't imagine trying to run that much cable with the plaster in place! I checked with them first and made sure the clearances between low-voltage and power cables were decent and that any intersections were perpendicular. I made sure I mounted all the brackets for data and speaker ports at the same heights as they had done for the power poitns etc.. Looks neater that way.

I cleared it with the electricians first

[Jarro]

:smt030 i like beer :smt030

[connico]

Bris if the wire is there, you can find it with a wire detector, or electrician can atleast, hell just hammer a hole into your double sheeted plaster, at the right height and run the wire through, thats if you remember the exact location lol :P

[ploppy]

Just a side note ... you've got Cat 6 cable. Why not get a Gb (10/100/1000) switch? If you have to copy files from 1 pc to another you'll appreciate it in the long run.

In answer to your first question ... Why go name brand? I've found that some of the Netgears/Dlinks tend to reboot/freeze intermittenly when trying to handle a large number of connections. But they'll do fine in your scenario provided your not intending on download using a Torrent applicaiton.

[Fishman Dan]

Just to water down Ploppy's comments, i've never had a problem with NetGear (except for a power supply dying), but D-Link are to be generally avoided.

[markTHEblake]

ploppy, I was going to suggest that too but then i saw the price difference, isnt a gigabit switch going to cost circa $500+ where a standard 10/100 starts around $150.

[Fishman Dan]

You can get various flavours of NetGear from $200-ish? GS-108 8 port is around $200, GS-116 around the $450 mark, and well up over $500 from there for 24.

[connico]

whats wrong with downloading torrent, its only some porting and nating you need to configure before it works right...

regardless, gigabit is good but you'll need the adaptors for it and most new computers come with it, mine did and its 6 months old..

regardless just a standard 10/100 switch that should do for the time being