Good hands V body swings!

[Coldtopper]

Any Aussies with a good set of hands on tour atm? In the past many of the top players had great hands and able to hit all types of shots making them great strikers of the ball. Anyone seen a flusher worthy of a mention? Plenty of swingers around but they are boring as imo!

[razaar]

What are you talking about, bungee?

[virge666]

I think he is looking for shotmakers. not bomb and gouges.

Anthony Summers comes to mind.

[Coldtopper]

What are you talking about, bungee? compare Garcia v Scott actions. Plenty of other examples the very fact that some may not know about describing a players hands in thier action player may answer the question.

[razaar]

compare Garcia v Scott actions. Plenty of other examples the very fact that some may not know about describing a players hands in thier action player may answer the question.The difference nketween Scott and Sergio IMO is Scott locks his wrists at the top whereSergio increases his wrist flex during the downswing. Everything else is similar. Nothing to do with hands, they are part of the club.

[Coldtopper]

The difference nketween Scott and Sergio IMO is Scott locks his wrists at the top whereSergio increases his wrist flex during the downswing. Everything else is similar. Nothing to do with hands, they are part of the club. The term good hands refers to a players hand action through the ball! Its not that complicated. Bowditch has a fair set of hands

[PeteyD]

And a great mono brow

[razaar]

I know, it makes no sense when the hands are holding the club and the wrists are the medium through which the power is transmitted to the club head.

[Coldtopper]

And a great mono brow I wonder if Lefty can offer some advice here? Surely fashion includes a little manscapping!

[Coldtopper]

I know, it makes no sense when the hands are holding the club and the wrists are the medium through which the power is transmitted to the club head. Try this hands v big muscle actions debates
http://t.golfweek.com/news/2005/sep/26/2005-big-muscles-dont-impress-good-hands-people/?

[razaar]

There are always some players who have extreme strength and flexibility in their wrists. These players give the impression that their wrists are doing most of the work. Allen Doyle is one who comes to mind. Check out his swing on u tube.

[Scifisicko]

Love watching Peter Lonard shape an iron....mmmmm, tasty.

[Coldtopper]

There are always some players who have extreme strength and flexibility in their wrists. These players give the impression that their wrists are doing most of the work. Allen Doyle is one who comes to mind. Check out his swing on u tube. Plenty of Yanks with good hand actions playinb on tour atm not many Aussies these days. The Sinnot kid looks the goods!

[razaar]

Plenty of Yanks with good hand actions playinb on tour atm not many Aussies these days. The Sinnot kid looks the goods!He is a potential champion, hots it out of sight. Our amateur program is turning out real talent in recent years. I'm fortunate to get to play with the 2013 Aust Amateur Champ and see the talent first hand.

[Coldtopper]

He is a potential champion, hots it out of sight. Our amateur program is turning out real talent in recent years. I'm fortunate to get to play with the 2013 Aust Amateur Champ and see the talent first hand. Cameron Smith can play and has a great opportunity to go on with it! Decent action btw

[razaar]

Cameron Smith can play and has a great opportunity to go on with it! Decent action btwIf he survives the Suberu WRX STI experience.

[davepuppies]

I am a hacker, but are you referring to releasing with the hands (flipping) vs releasing with the body?

[mrbluu]

I am a hacker, but are you referring to releasing with the hands (flipping) vs releasing with the body?

I'm also a massive chopper, but releasing the club with the hands and flipping are 2 different things.......

[razaar]

Hogan in his book " Five Lessons....." (lesson 4) states in capital letters - The main thing for the novice or average golfer is to keep any conscious hand action out of the swing. The correct swing is founded on chain action, and if you use the hands when you shouldn't, you prevent this chain action.

[Coldtopper]

I am a hacker, but are you referring to releasing with the hands (flipping) vs releasing with the body? No. Talking about a player who releases the club head and can move the ball both ways and adjust flights at will with out changing set up postion as an simple example of the characteristics of a hands player. These players can adjust the swing mid motion to compensate for being out of postion occasionally!

[Coldtopper]

Hogan in his book " Five Lessons....." (lesson 4) states in capital letters - The main thing for the novice or average golfer is to keep any conscious hand action out of the swing. The correct swing is founded on chain action, and if you use the hands when you shouldn't, you prevent this chain action. Yes and Jack was the greatest hands player to ever play! At a guess 50% of the current worlds top 10 woud be classified as being hands players

[razaar]

Yes and Jack was the greatest hands player to ever play! At a guess 50% of the current worlds top 10 woud be classified as being hands playersDon't confuse hands with forearms and upper arm technique both of which influence how the wrist joint works to move the hands (and the club). It is not the other way around.

[TheNuclearOne]

Here's an example or two of the hands player.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZDqIFkuJA4


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmJlyzdavOA


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGc1TD2sruI

[Coldtopper]

Don't confuse hands with forearms and upper arm technique both of which influence how the wrist joint works to move the hands (and the club). It is not the other way around. Maybe you can change the way that describes a golf swing and defines a players shotmaking abilities!

[Coldtopper]

Here's an example or two of the hands player.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZDqIFkuJA4


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmJlyzdavOA


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGc1TD2sruI Aoki in his prime was the best of best nice post TNO! Still recall his 28 on the back nine in the 88 Coke Cola classic at RM! Amazing talent. Plenty of great ball strikers in Japan during this period

[razaar]

Maybe you can change the way that describes a golf swing and defines a players shotmaking abilities!How about - great ball striker. "Great hands" can be reserved to drop on the opposition when you need an advantage.:)

[Coldtopper]

How about - great ball striker. "Great hands" can be reserved to drop on the opposition when you need an advantage.:) Sorry missed something here!

[razaar]

Sorry missed something here!I get the impression that you still believe that there is a hands swing and a body swing in the world's elite golf ranks. My best advice is to do research on "conservation of Angular Momentum " as it relates to the golf swing. Golf teacher and author Joe Dante in his book "The Four Magic Moves to Winning Golf" (published in the late 1960's) devoted a full chapter to this topic. It is a book worth having in your golf library.

The term "great hands" is also associated with the sport of boxing. I'm guessing that it describes a boxer who has great hand speed and delivers a heavy hit. If he used the muscles in his hands to hit an opponent it would be classed as a slap. A solid punch in boxing starts from the ground up and is landed with the weight of the body behind the punch resulting in a sustained blow. Just before impact the muscles in the forearm and wrist joint brace for the shock of impact. The hands are the point of impact in a chain of actions.

If a golfer consciously uses his hands to speed up the club head during the downswing, he will slap the ball. What he needs to do is to keep his hands from releasing until they are opposite his right leg and brace the forearms to break the inertia of the ball at rest. The art of a great ball striker is that every movement in his swing has a specific purpose in a chain of movements, with the hands tasked with the job of securing the club.

Ben Hogan's quote "Reverse every natural instinct and do the opposite of what you are inclined to do, and you will probably come close to having a perfect golf swing" really applies to those golfers who come to golf as adults. What we see when we watch Rory McIlroy swing or any other touring pro swing, are movements that are caused by deliberate movements that we can't see. These deliberate movement are the key to understanding the player's swing. When we get a lesson or a series of lessons, the pro is faced with the decision to teach these key deliberate movements (if he knows them and which are quite difficult to explain, and risk losing the pupil and income) or teach something like the pupil sees the pros doing and rely on the pupil's hand/eye co-ordination to get the ball airborne in the right direction. The majority of golfers who come to golf after playing other sports learn golf by watch others swing. That is probably the main reason why the handicaps of the majority of golfers never change much from generation to generation. We've never been taught the real elements of the golf swing.

[Coldtopper]

There are two types of golf swing types being referred to as large muscle dominance and the other is know as a hands swing. These terms have been used to describe golf swings for 30 years+ by golf professionals throughout the world! Thats all not needed to be analysed in such depth!

[backintheswing]

That was Ray's short answer. Wait for the in-depth follow-up.

[razaar]

There are two types of golf swing types being referred to as large muscle dominance and the other is know as a hands swing. These terms have been used to describe golf swings for 30 years+ by golf professionals throughout the world! Thats all not needed to be analysed in such depth!Really. Are you certain that it is not your personal concept of the difference between long swings and a shorter action and differences in body types? Unless we know the essential elements of a golf swing, then we are speculating and open to all sorts of misconceptions about the swing.

[Coldtopper]

No! If you can come up with improved interpretive terms for classifying golf swings then Im sure you could make a few dollars!

[Coldtopper]

As a matter of interest what do you play off Razor?

[razaar]

What I play off is irrelevant to the discussion. Have played off a low handicap for 50 years, and like most golfers I played with the wrong concepts of an efficient swing. Forty of those years were on what I refer to as the dark ages in learning the proper technique. A time when golf journists wrote instruction on the golf swing based on what we could see. The real secrets of the swing were rarely mentioned in print or if they were, they appeared in wording that was misleading.

[3oneday]

I like how you threw a word like interpretive out there, to counteract a 4 paragraph novel from the raz :)

Round and round we go, where's Jono?

[mrbluu]

I like how you threw a word like interpretive out there, to counteract a 4 paragraph novel from the raz :)

Round and round we go, where's Jono?

I heard he has taken up cycling.....

[3oneday]

Hopefully not pulling babies out of drains!

[Coldtopper]

What I play off is irrelevant to the discussion. Have played off a low handicap for 50 years, and like most golfers I played with the wrong concepts of an efficient swing. Forty of those years were on what I refer to as the dark ages in learning the proper technique. A time when golf journists wrote instruction on the golf swing based on what we could see. The real secrets of the swing were rarely mentioned in print or if they were, they appeared in wording that was misleading. I like your honesty! Play well

[razaar]

Hopefully not pulling babies out of drains!Cooling off in his spar if he is lucky. Still flogging clubs 3?

[Coldtopper]

I like how you threw a word like interpretive out there, to counteract a 4 paragraph novel from the raz :)

Round and round we go, where's Jono? How are your hands going 3OD? Based on your swing posted you have good hands! Playing well ?

[mrbluu]

How are your hands going 3OD? Based on your swing posted you have good hands! Playing well ?

3OD theory on the hands in relation to the golf swing are if u are hitting too far left u haven't spent enough time in the shower pre-round, if u are hitting it too far right then you were in there too long!!!

[Coldtopper]

3OD theory on the hands in relation to the golf swing are if u are hitting too far left u haven't spent enough time in the shower pre-round, if u are hitting it too far right then you were in there too long!!! Thats why he can play

[mrbluu]

Thats why he can play Maybe he needs a second shower to help him with his putting ;)

[3oneday]

30 putts satdy, broken 80 three of the last four rounds and my handicap is going out.

Very few pulls though ;)

[mrbluu]

30 putts satdy, broken 80 three of the last four rounds and my handicap is going out.

Very few pulls though ;)

So u are having baths now????:D

[petethepilot]

What I play off is irrelevant to the discussion. Have played off a low handicap for 50 years, and like most golfers I played with the wrong concepts of an efficient swing. Forty of those years were on what I refer to as the dark ages in learning the proper technique. A time when golf journists wrote instruction on the golf swing based on what we could see. The real secrets of the swing were rarely mentioned in print or if they were, they appeared in wording that was misleading.

Ray won't say but like me he is getting on a bit!
He has and still is a good player who has studied this sort of stuff extensively.
He has a very analytical mind and is definitely smarter than pretty much everybody here.

Oh and BTW, when I played with Ray a number of years ago he was in low single figures.
Pretty good for a guy in his sixties!

[Coldtopper]

Ray won't say but like me he is getting on a bit!
He has and still is a good player who has studied this sort of stuff extensively.
He has a very analytical mind and is definitely smarter than pretty much everybody here.

Oh and BTW, when I played with Ray a number of years ago he was in low single figures.
Pretty good for a guy in his sixties!It is guys like Ray that make golf interesting.

[razaar]

Ray won't say but like me he is getting on a bit!
He has and still is a good player who has studied this sort of stuff extensively.
He has a very analytical mind and is definitely smarter than pretty much everybody here.

Oh and BTW, when I played with Ray a number of years ago he was in low single figures.
Pretty good for a guy in his sixties!Hey Pete, how is life in Tassie? SEQld has been in an extended dry period and as a consequence the courses with limited water supplies are really struggling. Times like this is when I wish we were in Tassie.

[PeteyD]

Classic understatement Ray. Dry as up here with awful amounts of run.

[petethepilot]

People say it is cold here but looks like you got more ice yesterday than we get!

Hope no one here got damaged/hurt!

[Steve57]

Classic understatement Ray. Dry as up here with awful amounts of run.
Hey Pete how about you repeat this statement.
It seemed to bring rain!

[PeteyD]

Ha! Awesome having rain!

[oldracer]

interesting Tiger's post match interview he said something along the lines of he could start to feel his hands coming around, mentioned hands two or three times so it certainly is something that is uppermost to his game

[virge666]

Any Aussies with a good set of hands on tour atm? In the past many of the top players had great hands and able to hit all types of shots making them great strikers of the ball. Anyone seen a flusher worthy of a mention? Plenty of swingers around but they are boring as imo!

I dont think it is required anymore. Bubba moves the ball quite a bit but most of the others dont. (not on purpose anyway)

the ball is just too hard and they dont have to keep the spin down with iron shots any more...

Also - i dont think being a great ball striker means you you can hit all kinds of shots any more. I think it is more about controlling the distance and trajectory or height.