Wallabies!!

[Tongueboy]

There are one or two rah rah followers on this forum so does anyone have thoughts as to why the Wallabies are so rooted at the moment and can anyone see a way out? I can't and I don't know if Super Rugby contributing towards this with these extra franchises or what. There also seems to be an attempt to strip club rugby of their best players so is that having an effect?:?

[Captain Nemo]

As a despiser of Rugby I enjoy going out to ANZ watching the Wallabies games (PROB CAUSE ITS FREE AND I GET ON THE DRINK)
My thoughts are pretty much aligned with this article:
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/with-amigos-like-these--20130816-2s24k.html

[Monsta]

Get rid of James Oconnor............................. useless git

[Tongueboy]

Yeah I remember reading that article and it seems to be a major part of the problem. I personally would not feed O'Conner, Cooper or Beale to be honest with you and I don't understand how Deans and McKenzie tolerated it or the ARU for that matter.

[Daves]

As a despiser of Rugby I enjoy going out to ANZ watching the Wallabies games (PROB CAUSE ITS FREE AND I GET ON THE DRINK)
My thoughts are pretty much aligned with this article:
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/with-amigos-like-these--20130816-2s24k.html

Totally agree with that article. Money and Egos corrupt when you have weak minds and no attachment to the history.

[Captain Nemo]

Mcenzie needs a big cleanout.
Bring in some young rookies with no ego's and start again.
He'll they are getting touched up deluxe with the current line-up, may as well give other guys a go and try and rebuild?

[PeteyD]

Lack of discipline, pandering to egos. All sorts of stuff. Link will turn that around, but it will not be something that happens overnight.

Surprising we had a win in the rain (something the Wallabies are notoriously hopeless at) against the Pumas. There is some good new talent coming through, which if treated properly and not pandered to will see a turn around.

Another issue we have is playing the All Blacks every year. They are the best team in Rugby, by a long way. This can be considered good, benchmarking against the best in the world, or bad, losing becomes a habit.

It will be an interesting few years leading into the next world cup.

[Monsta]

Another issue we have is playing the All Blacks every year. They are the best team in Rugby, by a long way. This can be considered good, benchmarking against the best in the world, or bad, losing becomes a habit.

This is a good thing, not bad Petey, when we were the best in the world (with Eels, Gregan etc) the All Blacks actually stated that they would use the games against the Wobblies as a benchmark on how they were improving and what they needed to do to become the best

[PeteyD]

This is a good thing, not bad Petey, when we were the best in the world (with Eels, Gregan etc) the All Blacks actually stated that they would use the games against the Wobblies as a benchmark on how they were improving and what they needed to do to become the best

I think it is good. A lot comes to the current attitude to losing as well. To compete you have to hate losing. I think that is missing in some of the current squad (the amigos is a classic example).

I have no idea why the scrum can perform well one week and be awful the next. This has hurt the wobblies a lot (particularly against SA).

[Monsta]

I agree Pete, my nephews U17 scrum performs with more consistancy than our national team at the moment.

We will never beat the All Blacks or SA with the team we have now, get rid of Beal, Oconnor, Cooper. New blood is needed.

[sms316]

Not enough Waratahs in the team.

[Monsta]

Not enough Waratahs in the team.

Shut up, no one asked from you :D

[mrbluu]

IMO (I'm not a massive Rugby follower), that story was about bad management, coach and selectors. Sure those players stepped out of line,but as in any organisation there are ppl who will always push the boundaries of what the can and can't get away with. There were no real repercussions to their actions, as they would be fined then they kept getting selected, why would the players feel like the need to change.

Beale was the perfect example, punches a teammate on the plane, gets suspended by his team and then was selected by Deans to play the Lions.

I agree that the Wallabies need a good clean out and get back to basics.

[virge666]

I don't think anyone needs to go.

They changed their game plan under Link four games ago and don't have the skill level to execute it.

They have not been able to adapt to the new scrums rules - which a ****ing retarded anyway, but the other teams seem to be able to work them.

And the line out has been shithouse.

Fix that - an we would do OK.

[TheNuclearOne]

I don't think anyone needs to go.

They changed their game plan under Link four games ago and don't have the skill level to execute it.

They have not been able to adapt to the new scrums rules - which a ****ing retarded anyway, but the other teams seem to be able to work them.

And the line out has been shithouse.

Fix that - an we would do OK.


So probably back to the basics and execute them better Virge?

Disclaimer - watch the odd game but have very little understanding.

[sol381]

Theres only 2 problems with the wallabies at the moment.. The forwards and the backs.. The backline doenst even look like scoring when they get the ball.. Cant remember the last time they made a clean break...Im not a fan of cooper.. He is too erratic and most of the time his backline has no idea what he's going to do...Falau will only get better with time i think.. They need some bigger running backs. guys like sterling mortlock.. The forwards arent that bad.. As virge said the lineout is a lottery.. Some blame has to go with steven moore. Never been a huge fan of oconner.. Too scared to tackle or run the ball up in case a hair gets out of place. They miss pocock more than anything. He was by far their best player and things started to fall apart after his injury. This team isnt a team i see in 6 months time.. Will be at least 6 or 7 changes between now and then....Need to play some lesser sides to try out some new moves and get some confidence back.. Getting flogged by all blacks and south africa is doing then no good at all.

[virge666]

So probably back to the basics and execute them better Virge?

Disclaimer - watch the odd game but have very little understanding.

Rugby is a game set around the set piece. If your set piece play is falling apart - then you have no game. All you can score on is infringements.

The big difference between Rugby and League is that Rugby is a game about making space to run and League is a game about using space. With No 10m rule in Union, time and space is a premium. In League - you have 10m in which to get some speed up, cause confusion in defense or at the very least get some momentum

In Union, we don't have that luxury, so you need a forward pack that can push their defensive line back to give the backs some room to create something.

Australia has always had a mobile forward pack, not a large aggressive one. So the new law changes have crippled us. The breakdown is a problem as we don't have this aggression or muscle to clear other players out. So we get slow ball and a charging defensive line. This means that that the halves have to stand further back and pass deeper to get the same amount of space which is also a big disadvantage.

We could have all three Ella's and Campo in the backline and even they cannot do anything with out any time or space.

[TheNuclearOne]

Cheers Virge, i can certainly follow that. Funnily enough the lack of a 10m rule had never actually registered to me lol

[PeteyD]

Nice summary Virge. Makes you see how good Gregan was to do what he did behind an under performing pack.

[backintheswing]

Here is my take on Rugby Union from where I look at it.

From what I can see, the player talent comes from inner city Brisbane and Sydney private schools. My 15 yo son has recently been to the Qld state titles in Brisbane for both League and Union. The standard of athlete at the League championships was miles ahead of the boys playing union.

So why is that? In the country areas of QLD, there is very limited Rugby junior competitions, but everywhere you go there is a very strong league competition. I imagine NSW is the same.

The only union comp that matters for union at a junior level in Brisbane is the GPS comp played by the most prestigious schools. Its only a short season as well. The only way to win these GPS comps is to offer scholarships to country league players or polynesian boys. Lets face it, if your parents are mega rich, and you go to a school where they pay $25k a year for school fees, you may not have the desire to be a professional rugby union player.

So if the Wallabies want to succeed, they need to pull their finger out and inject some cash into the grass-roots junior programs across the country, otherwise we will struggle to beat anyone in 10 years time.

In Mackay, a smallish city of about 100,000 people in the district, there is 12 Under 15 Rugby League teams (about 240 players). The union season has just started playing on a Friday night, and we can't get enough kids for 2 teams to play sevens against each other.

[8081travis]

Rugby is a game set around the set piece. If your set piece play is falling apart - then you have no game. All you can score on is infringements.The big difference between Rugby and League is that Rugby is a game about making space to run and League is a game about using space. With No 10m rule in Union, time and space is a premium. In League - you have 10m in which to get some speed up, cause confusion in defense or at the very least get some momentumIn Union, we don't have that luxury, so you need a forward pack that can push their defensive line back to give the backs some room to create something.Australia has always had a mobile forward pack, not a large aggressive one. So the new law changes have crippled us. The breakdown is a problem as we don't have this aggression or muscle to clear other players out. So we get slow ball and a charging defensive line. This means that that the halves have to stand further back and pass deeper to get the same amount of space which is also a big disadvantage.We could have all three Ella's and Campo in the backline and even they cannot do anything with out any time or space.Virge that is one of the best descriptions I have heard and I work in the game. New laws coming from the IRB will continue to kill us at scrum time and with a culture built on running rugby our our focus on set piece needs serious addressing

[PeteyD]

Here is my take on Rugby Union from where I look at it.

From what I can see, the player talent comes from inner city Brisbane and Sydney private schools. My 15 yo son has recently been to the Qld state titles in Brisbane for both League and Union. The standard of athlete at the League championships was miles ahead of the boys playing union.

So why is that? In the country areas of QLD, there is very limited Rugby junior competitions, but everywhere you go there is a very strong league competition. I imagine NSW is the same.

The only union comp that matters for union at a junior level in Brisbane is the GPS comp played by the most prestigious schools. Its only a short season as well. The only way to win these GPS comps is to offer scholarships to country league players or polynesian boys. Lets face it, if your parents are mega rich, and you go to a school where they pay $25k a year for school fees, you may not have the desire to be a professional rugby union player.

So if the Wallabies want to succeed, they need to pull their finger out and inject some cash into the grass-roots junior programs across the country, otherwise we will struggle to beat anyone in 10 years time.

In Mackay, a smallish city of about 100,000 people in the district, there is 12 Under 15 Rugby League teams (about 240 players). The union season has just started playing on a Friday night, and we can't get enough kids for 2 teams to play sevens against each other.

There is an extensive junior competition in Brisbane for Rugby. But yea, not a lot of support away from SEQ from what I can gather.

[backintheswing]

My sons used to play in that junior competition in Brisbane for Taylor Bridge Rugby. I wouldn't say its extensive. In most age groups the union only has 2 divisions. Junior league in most age groups in Brisbane has up to 12 divisions (Premier North and Premier south, and then Div 1 to Div 5 in both north and south). And I know that my sons played Premier division rugby league for St Brendans and the level of play was streets ahead of the division 1 union. There was no comparison.

Union just doesn't have the numbers at Junior level in Australia.

[PeteyD]

Wow. Where do you get the 2 divisions from? BJRU had 16 in u10 this year, similar in 11 and 12. Fewer division in 13-18, but at least 12 in each.

I don't know anything about the junior RL so can't compare. I do know that the organisation of the BJRU seems pretty amateurish.

[backintheswing]

Well I know when we were playing under 14 about 4 years back, there was 2 divisions. Under 16 was one division.

Granted in the younger age groups there will be a lot more, but I think that is because the mums let them play as it is not tackle, only 2 handed touch.

[PeteyD]

Seems like 3 or 4 divisions in 15s.

Anyway yea, the RU does not invest in junior dev like League does, and neither has the inroads the AFL is getting.

[backintheswing]

Seems like 3 or 4 divisions in 15s.

Anyway yea, the RU does not invest in junior dev like League does, and neither has the inroads the AFL is getting.

The numbers have really increased then since we lived there. Our club at Graceville suffered at under 13 and up, as most of the boys head off to private schools and only play the GPS school comp.

[PeteyD]

yea I remember the same thing happening at u10s at GPS when the kids all went to Marist Brothers.

[PerryGroves]

O'Connor, Perth Airport incident

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/rugby/wallabies-star-james-oconnor-reportedly-escorted-from-perth-airport-on-sunday-morning/story-fni2g0wi-1226722286941?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+DailyTelegraphSportndm+%28Dai ly+Telegraph+|+Sport%29

[Monsta]

O'Connor, Perth Airport incident

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/rugby/wallabies-star-james-oconnor-reportedly-escorted-from-perth-airport-on-sunday-morning/story-fni2g0wi-1226722286941?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+DailyTelegraphSportndm+(Daily +Telegraph+|+Sport)

Hope he gets sacked, never to return.........

[Daves]

O'Connor, Perth Airport incident

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/rugby/wallabies-star-james-oconnor-reportedly-escorted-from-perth-airport-on-sunday-morning/story-fni2g0wi-1226722286941?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+DailyTelegraphSportndm+(Daily +Telegraph+|+Sport)


Hope he gets sacked, never to return.........

O'Connor has form and this story may well true, but there are 2 versions of events going round, and frankly I give the Press little cred these days.

The wife filled me in recently about the supposed Mad Monday events of the Lions and Daniel Rich. She knows people close to the Lions. Seems the poor bastard may have been done over by a overly keen to write a sensational story journalist who did not bother checking his facts. All because he did a good deed for a disabled guy who apparently is known for making up stories to get attention.

[mrbluu]

O'Connor has form and this story may well true, but there are 2 versions of events going round, and frankly I give the Press little cred these days.

The wife filled me in recently about the supposed Mad Monday events of the Lions and Daniel Rich. She knows people close to the Lions. Seems the poor bastard may have been done over by a overly keen to write a sensational story journalist who did not bother checking his facts. All because he did a good deed for a disabled guy who apparently is known for making up stories to get attention.

I remembered reading something in this article that didn't make sense to me. If was escorted away by AFP and was causing havoc, how did he relay his versions of the events to the ARU from Bali???

http://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby-gold/wallabies-star-james-oconnor-reportedly-escorted-from-perth-airport-on-sunday-morning/story-fndptke0-1226722286941

(http://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby-gold/wallabies-star-james-oconnor-reportedly-escorted-from-perth-airport-on-sunday-morning/story-fndptke0-1226722286941)

[Peter]

How good is Israel Folau in the air?

[Ron Burgundy]

What odds would have been given 6 months ago on Cooper cementing a starting spot, being made vice-captain and in great form? Remarkable.

Great to see us finally win 2 in a row and playing decent rugby.