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Jarro
1st January 2006, 12:02 PM
Tiger calls for 'tougher' game
January 1, 2006

WORLD No.1 Tiger Woods admits he would like to see golf officials make the game tougher.

The 30-year-old is convinced that the dramatic changes to the golf ball and clubs over the past few years have dramatically altered the sport and reduced a lot of the shot-making and skill.

"It's all about keeping the skill factor. At the moment, equipment has brought everyone closer together. It's harder to separate from the field, without a doubt. It's a challenge," Woods told Golf Digest.

"I'd like to see more spin added to the golf ball, so misses would be more pronounced and good shots more rewarded," Woods said. "Anytime you bring manoeuverability back into the game of golf, it's going to favour the better players who understand how to control the golf ball.

"I'd eliminate the 60-degree wedge and set a 56-degree limit.

"For one, it would bring more feel back into the game. Because now guys lay up to exact yardages and hit nothing but full shots. Nobody hits half shots anymore.

"And it would make the short game around the green a lot harder. If guys didn't have a 60-degree or even a 64-degree wedge to save them, you wouldn't see them being as aggressive going into the greens, because they couldn't short-side themselves as much."

Woods said he would like to see golf the way it used to be played and a return of the shot-makers.

"I enjoy moving the ball and hitting different shots, and I think that's the way golf should be played," he said.



Woods admits he was forced to join the rest of the tour and exploit the changes made to the equipment.
One key reason was that dozens of players who he used to outdrive, were bombing the ball past him.

"I didn't originally go along with the equipment changing everyone else was doing, and I got left behind," he explained.

markTHEblake
1st January 2006, 01:18 PM
if they do release a 'tour' ball that spins more and is not as long, it wont be be any different to the early 90's and before when almost all good golfers sacrificed distance to use Balata's.

Jarro
1st January 2006, 01:45 PM
sounds like Tiger wants them to do more than change the ball Blakey, he's asking for lob-wedges to be scrapped too.

markTHEblake
1st January 2006, 02:34 PM
if they are all forced to use old balatas they wont need a lob wedge

Jarro
1st January 2006, 03:11 PM
if they are all forced to use old balatas they wont need a lob wedge

why :?:

are you saying that if they play old balatas they won't miss any greens :?

I think if you asked ALL the PGA tour pro's that they had to hand in their lobbies there'd be a real stink.

markTHEblake
1st January 2006, 04:01 PM
do you know what a balata is?

a Balata spins heaps more than any golf ball on the market today. thus, they dont need a lob wedge to stop the ball on short pitch and chip shots.

60 deg weedges were around in the 80's and early 90's but hardly anybody was using them, except Tom Kite.

Jarro
1st January 2006, 04:06 PM
so your argument would be valid IF they do change the ball to an old balata type.

what if they don't :roll: I don't think Tiger was saying anything about decreasing the distance off the tee .... so the ball would still have to retain a lot of the features of todays balls.

markTHEblake
1st January 2006, 04:25 PM
so your argument would be valid

but I wasnt arguing :roll:

all I said was that as Tiger is suggesting they enforce a 'tour' ball, it is much the same as the scenario when 15+ years ago when most golfers used a 'tour' ball by choice.

Webster
1st January 2006, 05:29 PM
There is a lot of merit in what Tigger is saying. Realistically, they only need to go back to the specs of the Titleist Professional ball from about 5 years ago. It was similar to the balatas but a bit more hard wearing and went a touch further.

Blakey did you ever use the Spalding Tour Edition balls that Norman used in the late 80's? They spun way more than balatas. Cost the big blonde boy a couple of majors too due to over-spinning. Good ball though. A bit like the Strata Tour Professional but with twice as much spin.

markTHEblake
1st January 2006, 07:26 PM
No. dont know anyone that did and never saw them in the golf shop either.

Jarro
1st January 2006, 07:36 PM
i've got a couple of the Titleist Professional balls in my shag bag at the moment ..... nice to chip and putt with at least 8)

I'd love to see all the guys on Tour using the same ball. Be interesting to see who would be disadvantaged and who could adapt ... i'd expect the guys that are long off the tee would probably survive .. wheras guys like Pavin, Funk etc. would probably struggle for a while.

markTHEblake
1st January 2006, 07:56 PM
Davis Love once put up a fair arguement against Pro's using the same ball. He said that he always preferred a low spin ball becuase he hit it so hard, with a normal ball he hit too many ski jumps, which cost him distance.

I remember Mark McCumber who wasnt a long hitter also deliberately using a shorter ball for some reason.

Love said It would be cruelly unfair to make all players use the same ball, instead they should limit the characteristics of the ball, so players still had a choice to customise their game.

Now that I mentioned it, I cant remember hitting a Ski Jump for a bloody long time. Used to hit em all the time in the good old days of Persimmon heads. Used to know a bloke who could hit em with a 1 iron day in day out. No way you can do that with todays golf balls.

Jarro
1st January 2006, 08:09 PM
Love said It would be cruelly unfair to make all players use the same ball, instead they should limit the characteristics of the ball, so players still had a choice to customise their game.


bugger DL111 .... he's a dirty whinging ponce anyway :evil:

Golf is the only game i know of where the player can chose the ball he plays with. All other ball sports require the players to use the same type/shape/weight ball ... therefore evening out the playing field somewhat.

Make 'em play the same ball ... hell, they can even have their sponsors name written all over the bloody thing ... but make them play the SAME BALL WITH THE SAME CHARACTERISTICS

surely a purist like yourself Blakey would like to see what happened in this scenario .

BrisVegas
1st January 2006, 10:00 PM
There is a lot of merit in what Tigger is saying. Realistically, they only need to go back to the specs of the Titleist Professional ball from about 5 years ago. It was similar to the balatas but a bit more hard wearing and went a touch further.

I've got a sleeve of those on my desk next to me. I think they were donated by Blakey at the champs. Awesome golf balls. I'm not game to ever use them though... :oops: I would love to see the pro's balls limited to something like that. I think the shot-makers deserve to stand out from the crowd a bit more than they do now...

I don't agree with Tiger forcing players to hand in their lob wedges though.


Blakey did you ever use the Spalding Tour Edition balls that Norman used in the late 80's? They spun way more than balatas.
Maybe I'm thinking of a different ball, but the "Tour Editions" I remember weren't that soft at all... :?

terryand
1st January 2006, 10:06 PM
There is a lot of merit in what Tigger is saying. Realistically, they only need to go back to the specs of the Titleist Professional ball from about 5 years ago. It was similar to the balatas but a bit more hard wearing and went a touch further.

Blakey did you ever use the Spalding Tour Edition balls that Norman used in the late 80's? They spun way more than balatas. Cost the big blonde boy a couple of majors too due to over-spinning. Good ball though. A bit like the Strata Tour Professional but with twice as much spin.

They're the one that ended up yellow after about a month weren't they.I think they put out a new "whiter" version in the end.

Terry.

goughy
2nd January 2006, 07:26 AM
When pavin beat norman in a major (wasn't it a pga) they would have been using balata balls surely. I don't think it would disadvantage him too much from where he already is.

I think where it will disadvantage some guys, especially in the US is the high soft shots they hit no days. They';; have to be more carefull of the spin on the greens, and when they are off line imagine how much more sidespin they'll create with less effort. To hit their current fades and draws I'm sure they have to make a more aggressive move to move the ball. Those moves could end up in hooks and slices now.

There'll be more finess need for all shots.

I also remember seve saying in an interview a couple of years ago that the wedge should be limited to 54*.

Eag's
2nd January 2006, 07:26 AM
It would be great to see the world tours introduce a one ball rule but I don't think it will ever eventuate. Players & Manafactures would take legal action to prevent such a move.

Jack I remember the old Tour Editions, it was the first ball I ever used when I started playing back in 1987  :) they used to feel quite hard on the surface but would spin heaps.

Tez yes they did change the ball later on due to discolouration.

AndyP
2nd January 2006, 07:35 AM
I also remember seve saying in an interview a couple of years ago that the wedge should be limited to 54*.
Well, that could be two clubs knocked out of a lot of peoples bags.

It would be hard to police too.
"I'm sorry Mr. Woods but that wedge's loft measures at 54.1°, please hand back your winner's cheque."

goughy
2nd January 2006, 08:53 AM
I also remember seve saying in an interview a couple of years ago that the wedge should be limited to 54*.
Well, that could be two clubs knocked out of a lot of peoples bags.

It would be hard to police too.  
"I'm sorry Mr. Woods but that wedge's loft measures at 54.1°, please hand back your winner's cheque."

That's right andy. Will force the players to keep a check on equipment.

Personally, I think I should use my 54* much more than I do. Even out of bunkers. But that damn 60* keeps calling my name.

markTHEblake
2nd January 2006, 11:27 AM
Golf is the only game i know of where the player can chose the ball he plays with.

That would be because most of those other games you are thinking of are games where the ball is shared, so its not a fair comparison.

My Pro mate suggests making them use a ball with smaller dimples. It has less lift. A combination of that and a lower compression, and it would still allow golfers to choose their brand of ball and other characteristics to suit there game, without hitting 350m drives.


surely a purist like yourself Blakey would like to see what happened in this scenario .

Nope The one ball rule is silly and the PGA tour have already said they would never consider that and the ball manufacturers would protest with all means at their disposal.

However the 'tour' ball has merit and would allow all manufacturers to make and market their ball as the one the Pro's use. and Nobhead amatuers will still buy it.

Golfgirl
3rd January 2006, 07:36 AM
I don't know what measures should be taken, changing balls, regulating equipment, who know....

But I do whole-heartedly agree with bringing back "shot making" to the game.... I would much rather see someone finessing the ball around the course to shoot a low number, than someone banging it out there 300+ and hitting a wedge.....

Bring back Seve!!! Bring back Balata!!! But for God's sake, bring back "golf" to the game!!! :wink:

Matt 3 Jab
11th January 2006, 04:41 PM
they were a great ball the old professionals, many didnt switch to the pro v1 right away, and if i remember correctly there was somethign in golf digest about the multi layer revolution, it took over in around a year, before that everyone was using wound balata's, i remember try to fizz the guts out of the balatas when we found them all brown in the scrub, good fun and lots of fizz.

perci
12th January 2006, 10:17 PM
If control tyres are working in motor raceing why not a control ball.