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View Full Version : Top 10 in NSW.......Whats your rankings?



Speirsy11
20th November 2005, 07:44 AM
Grunt got me thinking with his Top 100 list.........What are the top 10 courses in NSW in your opinion......Not the top 10 designed, but the 10 that you would play above all others......

I've got the ranked like this:

1. The Australian
2. Newcastle GC
3. NSW
4. Royal Sydney
5. The Vintage
6. Concord
7. Monash GC
8. The Lakes
9. Elanora
10. Terrey Hills GC

Honorable mentions: Avondale GC, Castle Hill GC, Killara GC, St. Michaels, Bonville........

What do you think? If you had to recommend 10 courses to someone who could get on anywhere, what would they be?

Speirsy

cazandpaul
20th November 2005, 07:59 AM
If you could get on anywhere - Ellerston.

Otherwise your list really indicates the lack of depth in NSW courses - apart from the first 3 or 4 the rest are interchangeable.

Speirsy11
20th November 2005, 08:08 AM
If you could get on anywhere - Ellerston.

Otherwise your list really indicates the lack of depth in NSW courses - apart from the first 3 or 4 the rest are interchangeable.

I'd say the first 6 are pretty impressive......After that you can pick and choose whichever suits your eye best.....

Golfgirl
20th November 2005, 03:51 PM
For me Speirsy, the no. 1 course has got to be NSW.... :D

I just looove it - the best golf course that I have ever played on! :D

I haven't really been playing much - so I'll leave the rest of the list to you...... :roll:

I hope to be getting back into playing soon though.... 8)

Speirsy11
20th November 2005, 03:59 PM
For me Speirsy, the no. 1 course has got to be NSW....  :D

I just looove it - the best golf course that I have ever played on!  :D

I haven't really been playing much - so I'll leave the rest of the list to you......  :roll:

I hope to be getting back into playing soon though....  8)

The reason I have NSW ranked behind The Aussie and Newcastle is because the course has too many blind/luck/local knowledge shots. While the views are in the top 2-3 courses in the world, the course doesn't just layitself out there for you to beat. I'm a bigger fanof courses like the Australian, where everything is out in front of you and you either beat it by hitting the right shot, or you don't. Many great shots are punished at NSW which really doesn't fit my eye. While Newcastle has more blind shots then the Aussie, it doesn't have as many as NSW and it offers a more risk/reward strategical options, with reachable gambling par 5's and tough 3's........

Speirsy

Golfgirl
20th November 2005, 04:10 PM
Yes - all that you say is true... the blind shots are many and dangerous. I guess I had the advantage of Terry telling me the best place to hit each blind shot when I played it. A little local knowledge certainly does go a long way. :D But I just love the 6th.

Did you know that Greg Norman once commented that he wouldn't change a single thing about the NSW layout??

I do really like the Australian and Newcastle as well - although, I have only caddied/accompanied on those courses. (And The Lakes)

Newcastle had a couple of ripper blind shots - one par 5 in particular (it was being played as the first on that day, but I think it may not be the actual first???) had the professional field I was with completely bamboozled.

You have played a lot of the top courses!!! :shock: I am so very envious!!

Speirsy11
20th November 2005, 05:18 PM
Yes - all that you say is true... the blind shots are many and dangerous.  I guess I had the advantage of Terry telling me the best place to hit each blind shot when I played it.  A little local knowledge certainly does go a long way.   :D   But I just love the 6th.

Did you know that Greg Norman once commented that he wouldn't change a single thing about the NSW layout??

I do really like the Australian and Newcastle as well - although, I have only caddied/accompanied on those courses. (And The Lakes)

Newcastle had a couple of ripper blind shots - one par 5 in particular (it was being played as the first on that day, but I think it may not be the actual first???) had the professional field I was with completely bamboozled.

You have played a lot of the top courses!!!  :shock: I am so very envious!!

I've played NSW on several occasions and think that it has really suffered with the advances in technology. The landing areas 75 years ago are not the same landing areas as today. I played it once hitting nothing but 2 iron off the tee with a few friends who are members there, and it plays a lot differently (and I would suspect, a lot closer to how Alistar MacKenzie envisioned it).

The hole you're thinking of at Newcastle is likely the 10th, and it is one of the holes that I'm not a fan of. The tee shot has to be played at a funny angle and the second has no great attributes.

Speirsy

Andrew
20th November 2005, 09:44 PM
I am aware that Rob and I have diametrically opposed ideas of what we like a golf course to be, but that’s O.K., because everyone liking the same style of course would have killed off golf long ago.

I could be glib and say:
1.NSW
2.Newcastle

and then I would drive to Melbourne….. but I won’t say that. :lol:

Recommending 10 courses would depend on who I was recommending them to. As many of you are aware, I’m interested in golf course architecture & I have quite a few friends that are as well. I would recommend different courses to them than I would to friends who are just interested in having a nice round on a nice course.

NSW and Newcastle would be on the top of both lists. Here are the other 8 in no particular order.

To the Architect buffs:
Duntryleagues (Orange) – A lesser know Apperly creation.
The Australian – Experience early Jack.
Tallwoods – See what Dr Michael Hurdzan can do with a hilly site.
Royal Sydney - Check out how Ross did
Bonnie Doon - Check out what Ross is doing
Campbelltown – What did Bob do before he worked for Greg.
Ellerston – What Bob can do with a limitless budget.
Ryde-Parramatta - Example of a re-design with very little room to work. Use of angled greens the only means to create options

The North Shore of Sydney would be of little interest to these friends.

Not all of these courses are listed for ‘good’ reasons.



To my other friends:
Terry Hills
Ellerston
The Vintage
The Lakes
The Australian
Royal Sydney
Concord
Macquarie Links


My schedule for 2006: (Courses I have yet to play)
Kooindah
Magenta Shores
Pacific Dunes
Twin Creeks

AndyP
21st November 2005, 08:09 AM
Narooma doesn't make anyone's list?
Ocean Shores?

I'm a sucker for a good looking course, so I loved playing at Narooma, and would love to play at Bonville.
I haven't played 10 courses in NSW, so I can't do up a list, although those I have played are pretty good.
(Narooma, Bonnie Doon, Ocean Shores, Coolangatta Tweed, Catalina, Murray Downs)

Bruce
21st November 2005, 08:36 AM
I haven't played 10 courses in NSW, but of those that I have:

1 - Narooma.  I loved it and attribute a round there just over 12 months ago as the catalyst for wanting to play golf regularly.

2 - Tocumwal (Captains)

3 - Coomealla

4 - Tocumwal (Presidents)

5 - Catalina (Batemans Bay)

6 - Wentworth

7 - Finley

I think that's all I've played and most of them are only just in NSW.

marcel
21st November 2005, 10:11 AM
1. NSW
2. Newcastle



and then I would drive to Melbourne….. but I won’t say that. :lol:

Then I'd do the road trip with Andrew, it'd be fantastic, big station wagon, show tunes on the 8 track cartridge, stopping at Holbrook for 3 pies (and a leaf of lettuce, gotta keep the greens up) on the verandah.........

then drive back via the Murray and;

3. Murray Downs
4. Rich River
5. Cobram Barooga Old
6. Narooma
7. Australian
8. Royal Sydney
9. Concord
10. Terrey Hills

TS
21st November 2005, 12:11 PM
1. NSW
2. The Lakes
3. Newcastle GC
4. The Australian
5. Elanora
7. The Vintage
8. Avondale GC
8. Terrey Hills GC
9. Monash GC
10. Concord

I left out Royal Sydney becuase I haven't play there, so I wouldn't know how good is it.

Andrew
21st November 2005, 05:33 PM
stopping at Holbrook for 3 pies


That's fine for me, but what are you eating .........


......... or are you just waiting for the corn beef at Hotel Spencer :lol:

Golfgirl
22nd November 2005, 06:01 AM
The road trip sounds great - are girls allowed??? I eat meat pies.... Can we go as far as Barnbougle???? I don't think that I'll break 200 around there, but I'd like to see it anyway..... :lol:

I find it hard to rate golf courses on both playability and architecture.... probably due to my standard of play.

I am most often standing on a tee and assessing it from the point of view of what it would play like for a male professional than from the perspective of a female B grader..... :oops:

I can assure you that when you do start to look at courses from that perspective though, a lot of good courses just don't stack up - it seems as if the ladies tees are an afterthought, and often don't allow shots to the natural landing areas that are inherent in any fairway....

Marcel and Andrew played Shellharbour with me - a classic example if ever there was one.... Do you guys remember the tee shot off the 2nd hole??? From the ladies tee, the landing zone was nearly non-existent, prompting either a layup off the tee, or a hit and hope to a patch of fairway that sloped right to left into a hazard and was only 11m wide.... Horrendous golf hole..... :evil:

marcel
22nd November 2005, 08:37 AM
The road trip sounds great - are girls allowed???  
Of course, bring Mitchell and his amazing ballooons along as well. I guess hubby better stay at work to fund the whole thing



Can we go as far as Barnbougle????  I don't think that I'll break 200 around there,
Cunningly their pencils only have enough lead to post a score of about 150 so no probs there



Marcel and Andrew played Shellharbour with me - a classic example if ever there was one.... Do you guys remember the tee shot off the 2nd hole???  From the ladies tee, the landing zone was nearly non-existent, prompting either a layup off the tee, or a hit and hope to a patch of fairway that sloped right to left into a hazard and was only 11m wide....  Horrendous golf hole.....  :evil:

I don't but I'm sure steel-trap brain Andrew does, unless his hole in one wiped all previous golf memories. The only times, to my shame, I've really taken much notice of the ladies tees is when playing with the fairer sex, I'm sure you're right about them being an afterthought in many cases.

Golfgirl
22nd November 2005, 06:43 PM
The only times, to my shame, I've really taken much notice of the ladies tees is when playing with the fairer sex, I'm sure you're right about them being an afterthought in many cases.


:lol: :lol: :lol: Yeah, you weren't even really sure of them at NSW.... but all is forgiven for taking me there in the first place..... :wink:

jimandr
22nd November 2005, 10:33 PM
I'll start my list by saying that my pet golf course hates are blind shots, lay-up tee shots on par 5's, triple tiered greens and hidden hazards. I think Shellharbour has at least one of each. Strangely, I still enjoyed that course and want to go back when its not blowing 50mph. However, it doesn't make my top ten, which is highly influenced by aesthetic beauty rather than design purity. I also like history, which is why Royal Sydney and The Lakes make it although neither course impresses me greatly from a design point of view.

Assuming I'm playing with my mythical invited partners, my ten are:

The Australian
The Vintage
The Lakes
Royal Sydney
NSW
Newcastle
Bonville
Narooma
Mollymook
Tallwoods.

Honourable mentions to Tura Beach, Coffs Harbour, Tuncurry, St Michaels and The Coast (I like clifftop holes), Belmont and Macquarie Links.

Interesting that nobody has mentioned Mt Broughton (which I've never seen), Camden Lakeside or Horizons. They were in a few top tens not that long ago.

My revenge courses, just to bring my guests back to earth, would be Marrickville and Tree Valley. After playing them you'd never whinge about your home course again.

Grunt
23rd November 2005, 05:44 AM
My top 10 is going to be a hell of of a lot different to alot of you guys and girls as I have not played that much golf on high class golf courses. All of these courses I have played on.

1. Kapalua (Maui)
2. Newcastle
3. The Glades
4. The Vintage
5. Mount Broughton
6. Horizons
7. Camden Lakeside
8. St Michaels
9. The Coast
10. Bribie Island

I know it may not be the list that you all think but it does show my limited exposure to what many of you regard quality golf courses. I can play on any golf course and give it the respect it deserves. We are lucky here in Oz that we can go and play golf for as little as $20 a round and get a pretty good golf course.

I played Kapalua when in Maui getting married in 1997 and boy that was an experience, each year I watch the Mercedes Champs and say to myself I have played there :lol: The 17th there is just one of golf great holes to me. What a challenge! I think I lost 4 balls there trying to carry the rubbish to the green.

I played Mount Broughton about 10 years ago with a social club. It was one of the most difficult courses I had ever played at that time. I would love to go back and see how much I have improved since then, I think alot but it would be a good measure. I think I went close to 120 that day from memory.

I have played Horizons but the same weekend I got to play Newcastle :lol: and that put everything I remember about Horizons in another level the 2 courses are so different they could never be compared, one a resort sytle coure and the other a classic designed by one of the greats.

This list will definitlely change as I get to play more courses as time goes by but they are my top 10.

markTHEblake
23rd November 2005, 06:17 AM
Cant beleive nobody has mentioned Krambach, by far the best course in NSW.

Andrew
23rd November 2005, 07:22 AM
Interesting that nobody has mentioned Mt Broughton (which I've never seen), Camden Lakeside or Horizons.  They were in a few top tens not that long ago.



No it's not. :lol:



Grant, you have some unusual NSW courses on your list. I'll give you a geography lesson on Friday. :lol:

drunken
23rd November 2005, 07:34 AM
Interesting that nobody has mentioned Mt Broughton (which I've never seen), Camden Lakeside or Horizons.  They were in a few top tens not that long ago.



No it's not.  :lol:



Grant, you have some unusual NSW courses on your list. I'll give you a geography lesson on Friday. :lol:

My thoughts too....

Grunt
23rd November 2005, 07:40 AM
Oops I forgot about that little bit in the title of the thread :oops:

Grunt
23rd November 2005, 07:45 AM
After my total stuff up :oops: here is my NSW list.

1. Newcastle
2. The Vintage
3. Mount Broughton
4. Horizons
5. Camden Lakeside
6. St Michaels
7. The Coast
8. Nelson Bay
9. Liverpool
10. Riverside Oaks

Golfgirl
23rd November 2005, 10:43 AM
I'll start my list by saying that my pet golf course hates are blind shots, lay-up tee shots on par 5's, triple tiered greens and hidden hazards. I think Shellharbour has at least one of each.

And I'll confirm that it does.... :roll: :lol: To date, it is the course that I have shot both my lowest score in comp, and highest score in comp....... :roll: :oops:

Speirsy11
23rd November 2005, 03:12 PM
[quote="jimandr"]I'll start my list by saying that my pet golf course hates are blind shots, lay-up tee shots on par 5's, triple tiered greens and hidden hazards. [quote]

Preaching to the choir there brother Jim.........I absolutely HATE lay-up tee shots on par 5 holes, and much prefer having the course there for me to either take advantage of or have it as my own fault for not doing so....Hitting a good shot that gets punished because you can;'t see the trouble drives me nuts......

Speirsy

JJJ
27th November 2005, 10:04 PM
Andrew and Marcel,

Is there room in the car for me??

NSW - the best course in the state by a mile. If it wasn't for the weaker holes near the clubhouse it would be close to the best course in the country.

Newcastle - The "new" Apperly holes are as good as it gets. If I didn't keep looking at 3 and 4 and thinking that taking 40m off one and adding it to the other would vastly improve both holes I'd enjoy it even more.

As for the rest - well I can remember playing Royal Sydney for the first time and turning to my playing partner and asking if there was another 18 that they used for tournaments as surely they wouldn't hold an Australian Open on the track we were on. Since then not only has G69 cut loose at the place but the AGU have used Moonah Links twice which makes RS look much better.

BrisVegas
28th November 2005, 12:20 PM
NSW - the best course in the state by a mile.  If it wasn't for the weaker holes near the clubhouse it would be close to the best course in the country.

Newcastle - The "new" Apperly holes are as good as it gets.  If I didn't keep looking at 3 and 4 and thinking that taking 40m off one and adding it to the other would vastly improve both holes I'd enjoy it even more.

As for the rest - well I can remember playing Royal Sydney for the first time and turning to my playing partner and asking if there was another 18 that they used for tournaments as surely they wouldn't hold an Australian Open on the track we were on.  Since then not only has G69 cut loose at the place but the AGU have used Moonah Links twice which makes RS look much better.

Would dearly love to experience NSW and Newcastle in the near future.

Regarding Royal Sydney, yet to play it, but would be interested to see what golfer69 does to it! :wink: don't forget they've played an Open at The Grand too.... At least Moonah brought par back into the equation.

miro
28th November 2005, 03:20 PM
Bris,

NSW is a great golf experience. Newcastle really is over rated -condition is never better than average. Its simply a course with a lot of land so virtually all the holes feel isolated -other than that its just a good golf course.

Royal Sydney is an interesting one. I don't disagree with the call that its a bit mundane. Apparently the recently revised bunkering has made a big difference. The times I have been there it has always been in great condition -the clubhouse is an experience of itself. If you want to play a course of this nautre the Australian is in my opinion far better in all respects.

Golfgirl
29th November 2005, 07:58 PM
I'm looking forward to my first game at Royal Sydney, just to see what all the hype is about..... :wink:

Have to agree with Miro - the clubhouse is certainly an experience in itself. Never seen anything like it before, I was quite in awe when I got the Grand Tour of the joint :shock:

Andrew
30th November 2005, 11:26 AM
Newcastle really is over rated -condition is never better than average. Its simply a course with a lot of land so virtually all the holes feel isolated -other than that its just a good golf course.


Miro,

People obviously have different things they look for in a golf course. Everytime I have played Newcastle it has been in great condition (firm & fast), but I will say it is probably a course that people who are into golf course architecture would appreciate more.

I would go as far to say that, any Sydney resident who is unable to attain or wait for membership at NSW, and has a love for good architecture & exceptional routing, should join Newcastle & make the drive up as often as they can.

miro
30th November 2005, 03:54 PM
Andrew,

Re the condition of newcastle -for me "great condition" as you refer to it is what the Australian or NSW are always in. Newcastle in my 4 or 5 rounds there has never been anywhere near that level (but definitely in good condition). However, my definition of "great" may differ from yours.

Re the routing discussion I am yet to hear any comments that provide detail in that regard. whilst Newcastle has some fantastic holes it also has quite a few average and one or two maybe even poor holes (that stupid 215 - 230 odd metre par 3 3rd followed by the shortest Par 5 on a quality course in the country). Add that all up and I don't see how it can be mentioned in the same breath as NSW, RS, Oz.

Moe Norman
30th November 2005, 07:48 PM
of the courses in NSW that I have played I'd have to say that Newcastle it streets ahead of anything else.

The only course of not mentioned in this thread that I haven't played is NSW.

So on that basis I'd have Newcastle at least top 2. Royal Sydney is a joke and I quite enjoyed the Australian despite the bashing it gets from the Archie buffs.

Newcastle for me is one of the best in Aus.

Andrew
30th November 2005, 09:16 PM
Re the condition of newcastle -for me "great condition" as you refer to it is what the Australian or NSW are always in. Newcastle in my 4 or 5 rounds there has never been anywhere near that level (but definitely in good condition). However, my definition of "great" may differ from yours.

I enjoy the way Newcastle is maintained because it is firm and fast, which is the way I believe all sand based courses should be set up. Of the Scottish courses I have played, a mixture of the famous, the historic & the not so well know, all without exception are set up to be firm and fast. The greens may not always be tournament speed on some of those Scottish courses, but they are still firm. Clay based courses generally don’t have that option, especially in hotter climates.

Re the routing discussion I am yet to hear any comments that provide detail in that regard. whilst Newcastle has some fantastic holes it also has quite a few average and one or two maybe even poor holes (that stupid 215 - 230 odd metre par 3 3rd followed by the shortest Par 5 on a quality course in the country).

The best example of the excellent routing at Newcastle is the 5th & 6th. If you look at an overhead of the course you see that they are slightly separated from the rest of the course. The dune that the 5th is played over means that many architects would have missed those two holes. Apperley had no fear of routing a hole over a dune as is testament to his work at NSW, as he was responsible for the tee position on the 5th at NSW, as well as the 8th, 12th & 14th, all of which are routed over a dune.

The beauty of Newcastle’s routing is that it never gives you two drives in a row on the same parallel line. Even the 1st & 2nd which have parallel fairways have driving lines that are separated by 20%. The use of the fall away on the 7th sets the green with varying lines of difficulty. The use of the partial dune to the right of the fairway on the 8th sets up a risk/reward scenario with the small, slightly angled green that again uses a natural fall away. The natural slope right side of the 13th fairway makes a relatively easy 3 shot hole something to give greater consideration.

Regarding the 3rd & 4th. I actually think they compliment each other and I consider the two of them together as a par 8. For some reason ½ par holes are always controversial, but I think they add interest.


Add that all up and I don't see how it can be mentioned in the same breath as NSW, RS, Oz.

I don't consider Newcastle in the same breath as those courses. NSW is better & RS & Aus are worse :roll: .


Both the Aus & RS have far too many parallel driving lines to be considered great routing. Speak to any old timers who played the Aus over 30 years ago & they will all claim the Mackenzie course was light years ahead of the Nicklaus version they have now.

miro
1st December 2005, 08:07 AM
Andrew,

See there you go that wasn't that hard and it was quite informative.

What you haven't given consideration to is the vast unquantifiable number of MOSQUITOS that infest Newcastle -now surely that must come into the equation somewhere. :lol:

If you are around some time over christmas we should go up there and have a game -I can complain that the greens are average and you can point out the beautiful routing that got us there.

Miro

BrisVegas
1st December 2005, 08:25 AM
Moe/Andrew/Miro et al.... How does one get a game on these top NSW courses?

I'm aware that there are a few tee times preserved for the public at New South Wales GC during the week, but what about Newcastle, Royal Sydney and The Australian??

miro
1st December 2005, 08:49 AM
NSW -not easy unless you have mates who are members and can get on pretty easily.
Newcastle -simple if you are a member of another club then ring and they will let you play.
Australian -very tough as few members and without them yuo got no chance.
RS -millions of members but none actually play golf and without one you are no chance.

Andrew
1st December 2005, 01:07 PM
Brisvegas,

Being that you come from Queensland, you will find it a little easier. You will have to ring the clubs to see if they available times. It all depends if you think $320 for a round at The Australian is worth it.


Miro,

I'd be keen for a game in the new year. I'll bring the insect repellant. :lol:

miro
1st December 2005, 01:33 PM
We should get it organised. Anytime pre 18 January -I hit the skys for one month of skiing Canada then. Particularly I also am off the week after xmas as everyone is I suspect.

Moe Norman
1st December 2005, 08:55 PM
Newcastle is just as difficult as the others.

you need a member there also - I got on there through work.

I haven't actually played NSW but I've got a contact there for next time I'm in sydney

miro
2nd December 2005, 08:00 AM
Moe,

A phone call to newcastle and advising them of membership in Sydney has all that I have ever required. In fact our memberships have never even been questioned once at the course.

Grunt
27th January 2007, 10:56 PM
After my total stuff up :oops: here is my NSW list.

1. Newcastle
2. The Vintage
3. Mount Broughton
4. Horizons
5. Camden Lakeside
6. St Michaels
7. The Coast
8. Nelson Bay
9. Liverpool
10. Riverside Oaks
Have to update my list after playing some good courses in the past year & recently.

NSW
Newcastle
Twin Creeks
The Vintage
Pacific Dunes
Mount Broughton
St Michaels
Horizons
Coffs Harbour
Nelson Bay

Moe Norman
28th January 2007, 11:40 AM
Grant,

Has there been work done to Horizons and Camden Lakeside?

Horizons is above St Micks in your first list, then drops below in the second. With Camden Lakeside dropping off the planet.

Grunt
28th January 2007, 12:35 PM
I reckon St Micks is just better now that I know a little more about golf. Horizons is ok but St Micks is just that little better. Camden Lakeside is probably 12 or 13 now, just the fact other courses are better now.

petethepilot
4th March 2007, 10:41 PM
Speirsy,
I tend to disagree with you about 10 at Newcastle. For a start the hole is straight (so no funny angle on the drive). The hill on the tee shot challanges you (to not lay up) as the second shot from the top is too far (without great risk)to carry the second hill 100m short of the green. Secondly, there is a little flat area just over the second hill (ideal for the pitch shot to the green). Anything left of this follows contours down to the left into rough and an unlevel lie. Saying that, IMHO, the old green (changed 2 years ago) was superior as it gave you a sporting chance of knocking it on in 2 if you hugged the right side. The heroes on the committee and Cooper and assoc's removed that feature.

I do agree that Newcastle has to be one of NSW's great courses. The bunkers need work (in design not siteing) and the committee needs shooting. Otherwise, a joy to play.

regards,

the pilot :p

Courty
4th March 2007, 11:03 PM
Welcome Pete. 8)

Andrew
7th March 2007, 07:49 AM
Speirsy,
I tend to disagree with you about 10 at Newcastle. For a start the hole is straight (so no funny angle on the drive). The hill on the tee shot challanges you (to not lay up) as the second shot from the top is too far (without great risk)to carry the second hill 100m short of the green. Secondly, there is a little flat area just over the second hill (ideal for the pitch shot to the green). Anything left of this follows contours down to the left into rough and an unlevel lie. Saying that, IMHO, the old green (changed 2 years ago) was superior as it gave you a sporting chance of knocking it on in 2 if you hugged the right side. The heroes on the committee and Cooper and assoc's removed that feature.

I do agree that Newcastle has to be one of NSW's great courses. The bunkers need work (in design not siteing) and the committee needs shooting. Otherwise, a joy to play.

regards,

the pilot :p

Pete,

Both the 10th & 2nd greens could be easily fixed. Cooper & Assoc. are out of the picture now, as well.

The committee are looking to restore as much of the course as possible to the Apperly master plan from the mid-30’s. This is interesting, because while they have done a few small things in that direction, they refuse to clear trees & widen the course, which would have it playing more as Apperly would have envisioned it.

I believe the course needs the touch of someone with experience at restoring & renovating sandbelt courses, especially their bunkering. That scenario is still a work in progress.

Andrew
7th March 2007, 08:00 AM
I should have added, in the 1936 masterplan, the 10th was bunkerless. It will be interesting to see if the committee are firm in their convictions of restoration.

Moe Norman
7th March 2007, 09:11 AM
I believe the course needs the touch of someone with experience at restoring & renovating sandbelt courses, especially their bunkering. That scenario is still a work in progress. I believe Grant and Cashmore are busy at the moment ;)

Andrew
7th March 2007, 09:37 AM
I believe Grant and Cashmore are busy at the moment ;)

... And if either had the RQ job ?

Andrew
7th March 2007, 10:01 AM
Want me to give them a call ?

You wouldn't have Peter Thomson's number there, would you ? :lol:

Moe Norman
7th March 2007, 10:13 AM
Just call the local tree lopper, they won't charge a crazy design fee. I think Mike Clayton Design is sponsored by Stihl?

Then get the committee to appoint yourself to make the minor alterations required to a couple of tees and greens here and there :)

petethepilot
14th March 2007, 11:34 PM
As someone who has played Newcastle more than 500 times, I can tell you that trees are not an issue there unless you spray it around! They certainly do not effect the optimum lines to greens. The distance between tree lines is never less than 50 metres (mostly 60 m to 80 m plus!). The main defences at Newcastle are small (the old original Apperly ones anyway!) elevated greens protected by subtle mounding and tricky contours and the rolling undulating fairways that give a variety of uneven lies. Inprecise iron play that shortsides you or leaves downhill putts will cause you to rack up a score. The trees are initially intimidating as the undergrowth is thick (with snakes as well:) ) but only punish the truely wayward. The bunkers are all well positioned but their design forces problems as the club takes the easy way by machine rakeing. As most are bowl shaped this gives problems at the exit points. Another problem is that they have no defined exit point, so members climb out anywhere collapsing the faces and then dragging the sand from the middle to the edges.
The course is a classic test of golf. I appreciate the clubs efforts to return as much as possible to the old plan. The problem is that every green they have installed recently (last 5 - 10 years) is much larger in size and in general, multi-leveled (ie 1,2,3,10,12,13,14,15,18!!!). Apperly relied on small, subtely contoured greens that both challenged and rewarded good shotmaking. Lets hope they return it to that, although I doubt it as most of the committee are not renowned for their shotmaking skills.

Regards,

the pilot.;)

Andrew
15th March 2007, 05:55 AM
Pete,

I disagree with you about the trees. Tree encroachment has taken away the temptation to play a more aggressive line on both the 5th & 6th. Didn’t forget, it’s the canopy that effects the driving line & in both cases they reach just short of 50m. I am not talking about the ‘truly wayward’, but what tempts the better player to take a risk to gain greater reward.

The committee has possibly changed since you played the course 500 times, as there is now a former club & foursomes champion on the committee. That, of course, doesn’t mean they are going to do the right things, but we can only hope.


P.S. I saw the green staff get a lawn mower stuck over the edge of a bunker on the 14th a couple of weeks ago. They had to tow it out.

Grunt
20th March 2007, 07:55 PM
Have to update my list after playing some good courses in the past year & recently.
NSW
Newcastle
Twin Creeks
The Vintage
Pacific Dunes
Mount Broughton
St Michaels
Horizons
Coffs Harbour
Nelson Bay

Another Update

NSW
Newcastle
Twin Creeks
The Vintage
Macquarie Links
Pacific Dunes
Mount Broughton
St Michaels
Horizons
Coffs HarbourPlayed Macquarie links late week and found it very good, it slots in at 5 in my list.

AndyP
20th March 2007, 08:05 PM
Narooma doesn't make anyone's list?
Ocean Shores?

I'm a sucker for a good looking course, so I loved playing at Narooma, and would love to play at Bonville.
I haven't played 10 courses in NSW, so I can't do up a list, although those I have played are pretty good.
(Narooma, Bonnie Doon, Ocean Shores, Coolangatta Tweed, Catalina, Murray Downs)
I'm almost to 10 (can I count ACT?), I also left Mollymook off from last time. Silly me! I might add another 3 or 4 by the end of the year, including Newcastle, but for now:

1. Bonville
2. Narooma
3. Bonnie Doon
4. Mollymook
5. Ocean Shores
6. Murray Downs
7. Coolangatta Tweed Heads River
8. Coolangatta Tweed Heads West
9. Catalina (Bateman's Bay)

I'm not really clear on most of those rankings (except 1 & 2), as it's been a while since I've played some of them and my memory is crap.

dc68
21st March 2007, 10:41 AM
1.Bonville
2.St Micks
3.CTH West
3.CTH River
4.Coffs Harbour
5.Nambucca Heads
6.Murwillumbah


Hope to add to the list this year.

jimandr
28th April 2007, 05:18 PM
Assuming I'm playing with my mythical invited partners, my ten are:

The Australian
The Vintage
The Lakes
Royal Sydney
NSW
Newcastle
Bonville
Narooma
Mollymook
Tallwoods.

Honourable mentions to Tura Beach, Coffs Harbour, Tuncurry, St Michaels and The Coast (I like clifftop holes), Belmont and Macquarie Links.



Having played a few other high quality courses recently, it's time I reviewed this. I've thought a bit about which ones to leave out, because I think Magenta Shores and Macquarie Links need to go in, and I'm elevating Tuncurry because it is in good condition again.

In no particular order

The Australian
The Lakes
The Vintage
NSW
Newcastle
Bonville
Narooma
Magenta Shores
Macquarie Links
Tuncurry

I think I need to play Mollymook and Narooma again to remind myself of their merits.