Who has the best short game?

[popper81]

I have just watched a episode of Golfing World on fox and they had a special on Lee Trevino. I have a huge respect for yesteryear, but a very limited knowledge. From the footage though, Trevino had a fantastic short game. He had 4 chip ins during the British Open he won ( which is what we were watching), and holed some massive putts. The greens looked super bumpy as well. Got me thinking about how really good players hole out when they really need it. Ozgolf is a diverse group, so I am interested in what you all think.

Who do you think has the best short you have seen? Why?

[sms316]

Tiger. Daylight second.

[Captain Nemo]

Seve, full stop.
I've seen old footage, and what he did with those old balls, on both the US, and European style courses was amazing....

[live4golf]

Seve, full stop.
I've seen old footage, and what he did with those old balls, on both the US, and European style courses was amazing....

+1

[JADO75]

Brett Ogle

[popper81]

Brett Ogle

Clown ;)


I have to agree with SMS here, for me it is Tiger..... It is what I have witnessed and grown up with. I remember I always wanted to putt like Ben Crenshaw when I was younger. :)

[idgolfguy]

Stan Utley, when he was on tour.

[virge666]

Tiger. Daylight second.

Bullshit.

Currently, it is Luke Donald and Phil that hold the honours.

Tiger isn't even top ten, never has been.

[Steve57]

Nicklaus was every bit as effective as Trevino especially under pressure, but you cannot go past Seve - an absolute wizard around the greens!!

[PShaw]

Currently Donald all around as he holes more putts than anyone, but doesnt always chip it as good. His putting hides the sometimes average pitch or chip. Phil has the awesome ability to hit shots no one else saw as he has those crazy flop shots and isnt afraid of breaking with the norm, like using 64* wedges with minimal bounce.

Ross Herbert, RIP, was a genius who I had the awesome experience of working with from 97-99.

Seve was the greatest of his era, but also a magician in all forms of recovery.

But wheres Tiger. He is up there, but its more for his ability to produce in the most clutch positions like last weekend at the memorial and the 2005 masters.

Just my thoughts.

[Jarro]

Seve

[Veefore]

Stan Utley, when he was on tour.

I'm not so sure of that ID.
His stats were only average, even when he was on the Nationwide Tour. I think the only stat he ever led in was putts per round once (on the Nationwide) and that was because he was down near last in greens in regulation and he was a fairly good chipper. Even then, his scrambling stats were mid-level for a tour player.


Seve, full stop.
I've seen old footage, and what he did with those old balls, on both the US, and European style courses was amazing....


Same. He made the ball do things that mere mortals couldn't even imagine. I was so disappointed when I accidentally taped over my copy of the instructional video he put out. It didn't help me a lot but it was just fantastic to watch him control a golf ball.



Bullshit.
Currently, it is Luke Donald and Phil that hold the honours.

Tiger isn't even top ten, never has been.

The only thing I don't like about Tiger is that when he makes shots on TV the Commentators go wild "Did you see that? Only Tiger could have pulled that shot off!" Forget the fact that for most of them we've all seen lots of Pro's pull off similar shots or even seen someone in our own foursome some time do it. The commentators rave and the public believes.

These days, whenever someone in my group hits a spectacular recovery or just great shot I find myself saying "If Tiger had hit that shot the commentators
would be calling that the best shot ever hit in the history of golf!"


I guess I'm pretty cynical these days. :(

[TheNuclearOne]

Ballesteros.

Not the best by any stretch, but i always thought Faldo's short game was ridiculously underrated due to the emphasise on his full swing and the changes he'd put in. He wasn't flashy but had his share of hole outs and was so comfortable anywhere on the course.

[Dotty]

DC68.

[timah!]

DC68.

+1

[Dotty]

Tiger and Seve never knocked one in from a sandcastle surrounded by aluminium cans.

[popper81]

Tiger and Seve never knocked one in HALF CUT from a sandcastle surrounded by aluminium cans.

Fixed!

[Johnny Canuck]

Bullshit.

Currently, it is Luke Donald and Phil that hold the honours..

The two names that popped into my head when I came into this thread.

[sms316]

Bullshit.Currently, it is Luke Donald and Phil that hold the honours.Tiger isn't even top ten, never has been. To me to be the best you need to be able to produce under the pump. I don't remember seeing Luke Donald holing 10 footers to get into a playoff in a major. Come to think of it, what has Donald ever done on majors? Sure, Tiger has had a bit of a lull, but who hasn't at some point in their career? Seve couldn't break 80 for half of his, so how many putts did he hole?

[gazgolf1]

Phil.

[LowTee]

Currently Donald all around as he holes more putts than anyone, but doesnt always chip it as good. His putting hides the sometimes average pitch or chip. Phil has the awesome ability to hit shots no one else saw as he has those crazy flop shots and isnt afraid of breaking with the norm, like using 64* wedges with minimal bounce.

Ross Herbert, RIP, was a genius who I had the awesome experience of working with from 97-99.

Seve was the greatest of his era, but also a magician in all forms of recovery.

But wheres Tiger. He is up there, but its more for his ability to produce in the most clutch positions like last weekend at the memorial and the 2005 masters.

Just my thoughts.

Agree

[SundayHack]

To me to be the best you need to be able to produce under the pump. I don't remember seeing Luke Donald holing 10 footers to get into a playoff in a major. Come to think of it, what has Donald ever done on majors? Sure, Tiger has had a bit of a lull, but who hasn't at some point in their career? Seve couldn't break 80 for half of his, so how many putts did he hole?
Agree! Tiger has always hit it all over the place but his ability to make clutch putts or hole outs sets him above the rest. Phil and Seve both have great imagination around the greens. But for mine its old school Tiger.

[TheNuclearOne]

Jack Nicklaus is the best clutch putter i've ever seen.

I'll go for Philly Mick right now.

[meh]

To me to be the best you need to be able to produce under the pump. I don't remember seeing Luke Donald holing 10 footers to get into a playoff in a major. Come to think of it, what has Donald ever done on majors? Sure, Tiger has had a bit of a lull, but who hasn't at some point in their career? Seve couldn't break 80 for half of his, so how many putts did he hole?

Surely you don't mean that ridiculous lip-in to get in a playoff with rocco? Luckiest thing I've seen in golf, ever!!

[Dotty]

Phil M.?

The 'Doug Sanders' from 2 foot, after 'miracle' 5 iron off Augusta pine straw, excludes him from any short game list.

[dhills2]

To me to be the best you need to be able to produce under the pump. I don't remember seeing Luke Donald holing 10 footers to get into a playoff in a major. Come to think of it, what has Donald ever done on majors? Sure, Tiger has had a bit of a lull, but who hasn't at some point in their career? Seve couldn't break 80 for half of his, so how many putts did he hole?

Doesn't mean that Luke Donald couldn't get the job done if he actually found himself in that position.

Anyway, not sure what we're debating... clearly Robert Allenby is the greatest short game player of all time bar none :)

[Johnny Miller]

Bill Rogers.

[TR66]

Popeye

[rubin]

Golfnut.

His tour level short game requires that he use 4 wedges for the multitude of shots he can play on course.

Its special to witness.........

[Hux]

THIS FORUM LACKS MEMORY...

The lad with more skill than Phil, more chips in than Red Rock, more up and downs than SMS's porno collection.........


The Pup rules.

[rubin]

THIS FORUM LACKS MEMORY...

The lad with more skill than Phil, more chips in than Red Rock, more up and downs than SMS's porno collection.........

The Pup rules.

I thought u were talking about iGolf

[rubin]

Actually maybe igolf does have the best. Remember he claimed he could put everything to within 3ft from inside 100m

[TheNuclearOne]

Actually maybe igolf does have the best. Remember he claimed he could put everything to within 3ft from inside 100m

I remember you had the 30m wedge that stops on a dime near the pin mastered too! Well, 30m or so from memory, it's a while back :D

[KristianJ]

THIS FORUM LACKS MEMORY...

The lad with more skill than Phil, more chips in than Red Rock, more up and downs than SMS's porno collection.........


The Pup rules.

Eh...I've seen him miss a 6 inch putt. Granted they were on the worst public golf course greens known to man, but still...

[Daves]

Eh...I've seen him miss a 6 inch putt. Granted they were on the worst public golf course greens known to man, but still...That would only have been because he was too busy talking, telling you how good he was!;)

[TheNuclearOne]

Eh...I've seen him miss a 6 inch putt. Granted they were on the worst public golf course greens known to man, but still...

But that Philly flop man, that Philly flop!!!!!!!

[Dotty]

THIS FORUM LACKS MEMORY...

The lad with more skill than Phil, more chips in than Red Rock, more up and downs than SMS's porno collection.........


The Pup rules.
.... and more big 80's in his golflink than a Billy Joel playlist.

ps. His second approach usually ends up close to the hole.

[Webster]

Zigwah.

[Rodent]

The best short game I've seen is from Dorf.

[brian]

I was impressed by G-Mac's short game around Pebble for hi US Open win. He is pretty clutch.

[aym]

To me to be the best you need to be able to produce under the pump. I don't remember seeing Luke Donald holing 10 footers to get into a playoff in a major. Come to think of it, what has Donald ever done on majors? Sure, Tiger has had a bit of a lull, but who hasn't at some point in their career? Seve couldn't break 80 for half of his, so how many putts did he hole?

Agree, best short game is the ones that produce results, and tiger has enough there to prove it.


Surely you don't mean that ridiculous lip-in to get in a playoff with rocco? Luckiest thing I've seen in golf, ever!!

http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/4576.html

[raidrboy]

I'm not so sure of that ID.
His stats were only average, even when he was on the Nationwide Tour. I think the only stat he ever led in was putts per round once (on the Nationwide) and that was because he was down near last in greens in regulation and he was a fairly good chipper. Even then, his scrambling stats were mid-level for a tour player.




Same. He made the ball do things that mere mortals couldn't even imagine. I was so disappointed when I accidentally taped over my copy of the instructional video he put out. It didn't help me a lot but it was just fantastic to watch him control a golf ball.




The only thing I don't like about Tiger is that when he makes shots on TV the Commentators go wild "Did you see that? Only Tiger could have pulled that shot off!" Forget the fact that for most of them we've all seen lots of Pro's pull off similar shots or even seen someone in our own foursome some time do it. The commentators rave and the public believes.

These days, whenever someone in my group hits a spectacular recovery or just great shot I find myself saying "If Tiger had hit that shot the commentators
would be calling that the best shot ever hit in the history of golf!"


I guess I'm pretty cynical these days. :(

Maybe cynical but brutally honest

[TheNuclearOne]

I'm not so sure of that ID.
His stats were only average, even when he was on the Nationwide Tour. I think the only stat he ever led in was putts per round once (on the Nationwide) and that was because he was down near last in greens in regulation and he was a fairly good chipper. Even then, his scrambling stats were mid-level for a tour player.




Same. He made the ball do things that mere mortals couldn't even imagine. I was so disappointed when I accidentally taped over my copy of the instructional video he put out. It didn't help me a lot but it was just fantastic to watch him control a golf ball.




The only thing I don't like about Tiger is that when he makes shots on TV the Commentators go wild "Did you see that? Only Tiger could have pulled that shot off!" Forget the fact that for most of them we've all seen lots of Pro's pull off similar shots or even seen someone in our own foursome some time do it. The commentators rave and the public believes.

These days, whenever someone in my group hits a spectacular recovery or just great shot I find myself saying "If Tiger had hit that shot the commentators
would be calling that the best shot ever hit in the history of golf!"


I guess I'm pretty cynical these days. :(


I missed this originally, great post. I'm pickin' up what you're puttin' down. No-one has ever done some of the things Seve did, he often invented it as he went. Who could forget him stamping his arrival on the scene with his pitch and run up the sliver of turf between two bunkers in the 76 British.

Know what you're saying about Woods, nobody can talk up their heroes like the Yanks. He gets enough done without their ridiculous embellishments.

[Yossarian]

I haven't watched a lot of golf but Tiger does seem to hit a lot of great short game shots at times that make you think 'gee what a great time to hit that stiff/in'.

[dave1]

Phil or Seve ..Often they would put it in horrible spots and recover.

Tom Watsons short game is super. His british open shots were phenomenal shots.

[sms316]

Tom Watsons short game is super. His british open shots were phenomenal shots. Watson has been suspect from 4 feet throughout most of his career. Shocking call.

[James12]

Peter Fowler.

[dave1]

Watson has been suspect from 4 feet throughout most of his career. Shocking call. Hmmm 5 british opens is my counter arguement. Im sure he mde some putts in those wins...Or maybe he was just lucky?

[idgolfguy]

He chipped in on a few of them.

[sms316]

No doubt about Watson being very good, but not the whole package. The shit putt he hit when he had the chance to win the British Open a few years back was hardly a one-off.

[Courty]

One thing's for sure, it ain't Solarman.

[dave1]

It was a bad putt. Sure.

But he won many other times

[Veefore]

Watson's long putting was great, his short putting only average. He was an aggressive putter and always charged the hole. Later in his career his short putting suffered as more of those aggressive putts missed the hole and left just-as-long or longer putts back.

Though I've also heard and read that it was put down to the shakes that come from long-term alcoholism. I don't know if it's true or not but I've seen and heard it mentioned a few times now over the last 10 years or so.

[dave1]

Watson's long putting was great, his short putting only average. He was an aggressive putter and always charged the hole. Later in his career his short putting suffered as more of those aggressive putts missed the hole and left just-as-long or longer putts back.

Though I've also heard and read that it was put down to the shakes that come from long-term alcoholism. I don't know if it's true or not but I've seen and heard it mentioned a few times now over the last 10 years or so.

hmm interesting.

[TheNuclearOne]

This guy had one of the ATG short games, forgotten a bit due to length/power stopping him from winning oodles. To win a major and be competitive on the tour given his lack of length speaks volumes for his short game.

Here's one of the great shots ever, it's ridiculous


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFIjYhmPNn0

[sambo]

This guy had one of the ATG short games, forgotten a bit due to length/power stopping him from winning oodles. To win a major and be competitive on the tour given his lack of length speaks volumes for his short game.

Here's one of the great shots ever, it's ridiculous


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFIjYhmPNn0
haha wow

[TheNuclearOne]

It was ridiculous lol

[mrbluu]

I remember that shot, most players on tour wouldn't even be able to get it on the green...pavin is a genius!!!!

[Marto65]

Marto