Solar Power systems

[Jarro]

Who's got one, and how is it going for you ??

I just got a quote for a system that will achieve a 'nil bill' for us ... but the system costs $15K :shock:

Anybody had a system installed recently ?

[Grunt]

I have a 3Kw system, cost just on 10k and has chopped our bill from over $500 to around $150 a quarter.

[PeteyD]

You would be looking at least that Jarro. The systems they sell cheap cheap are crap crap and basically useless. Send Solarman a PM.

[Jarro]

You would be looking at least that Jarro. The systems they sell cheap cheap are crap crap and basically useless. Send Solarman a PM.

yeah, now why didn't i think of that :roll:

Grunt, the system i was quoted has a 5kw inverter and 18 solar panels.

[Grunt]

Ours is 3Kw with 16 panels, 4kw inverter

[solarman]

Somewhere on the Energex account, (ours is Ergon, so different), you will find what your daily energy usage is stated as kwh/day. Let me know what that is.

A 5KW system with good quality inverter and solar modules should be around $12K as it is competitive down your way. JUST STAY AWAY FROM THE CRAP STUFF.

Let me know what the gear is?

[kpac]

Its a technology that's getting a lot better.
Unfortunately the cash back government scheme doesn't encourage the latest tech stuff anymore than the cheap alternatives. Which is disappointing. But Bob will be able to tell you about the stuff.

[simmsy]

We got a 3.3Kw/4Kw inverter - cost about 12K after rebate. that was in June last year we are currently $350 in credit with the Power Authority over here.
Well worth the money imo.

we were spending $300+ / bimonthly on electricity before hand.

our house i think is pretty typical:

Evap A/C
2 fridges
3 TV's
2 CPU
Pool running 8 hours a day
4 bed/2bath.

[Jarro]

Somewhere on the Energex account, (ours is Ergon, so different), you will find what your daily energy usage is stated as kwh/day. Let me know what that is.

A 5KW system with good quality inverter and solar modules should be around $12K as it is competitive down your way. JUST STAY AWAY FROM THE CRAP STUFF.

Let me know what the gear is?

Bob, i'll PM you my details :)

[Hawkers2008]

We put a small system in a while back cost us towards $3k all up. I reckon we will get a money back inside 3 years. With the benfit of hindsight I probably should have put a bigger system in.

[Yossarian]

We got a 3.3Kw/4Kw inverter - cost about 12K after rebate. that was in June last year we are currently $350 in credit with the Power Authority over here.
Well worth the money imo.

we were spending $300+ / bimonthly on electricity before hand.

our house i think is pretty typical:

Evap A/C
2 fridges
3 TV's
2 CPU
Pool running 8 hours a day
4 bed/2bath.

That is like 5 extra drivers a week!

[peter_rs]

Got a little 1.5kw with a 3kw inverter. Halved the bill looking at adding the other 9 panels.

Grays had some cheap deals last week.

Get the largest system you can.

Watch for the extras on the install

[Jarro]

Thanks for the advice people .....

... especially Bob 8)

[just]

Aren't you afraid the bats will crap on the panels reducing their effectiveness?

[Jarro]

I'll kill them

[solarman]

Thanks for the advice people .....

... especially Bob 8)

Nearly 20 years of doing this stuff now, think I may have learnt a little, I hope.

[Jarro]

Nearly 20 years of doing this stuff now, think I may have learnt a little, I hope.

Again, a big sloppy kiss for Bob ....

.. collectable from maysey :mrgreen:

[solarman]

Again, a big sloppy kiss for Bob ....

.. collectable from maysey :mrgreen:

He likes it too, don't like tongue though, its all furry from that scotch he drinks and his whiskers give me a rash.

[jasonb]

I am having a 5kw system installed next month, using Trina panels & Sunnyboy 5kw inverter at a cost of $12600, hoping to halve our bill, worst 1/4 so far was $1145.00 swimming pool not running during that 1/4 , best is $750.

Stay at home mum, swimming pool, 2 young kids etc - cant wait till she goes back to work

[solarman]

That is a pretty big bill. The gear you are getting is pretty good. I imagine a system like that in Adelaide should give you around 20kwh/day in good weather in Adelaide 9as a yearly daily average), less all the crow crap landing on the panels.

Put the Mrs and kids on ebay on a "buy it now" basis so you can offset some of the costs.

[BrisVegas]

Bob, how many years do these $12-15k systems last for? I assume the warranty is a year or two?

We spend about $1k a year on electricity, so would need some assurances that a solar system is gonna last at least 12-15 years.....

[Jarro]

Bob, how many years do these $12-15k systems last for? I assume the warranty is a year or two?

We spend about $1k a year on electricity, so would need some assurances that a solar system is gonna last at least 12-15 years.....

The system we're getting has a 25 year warranty on the panels, and a 5 year warranty on the inverter.

[markTHEblake]

I would rather be sure that the retailler that is selling the system is going to last the term of the warranty, rather than how long the warranty is for.

[mike]

If it weren't for the big initial outlay I'd do this tomorrow. And I'd get Solarman to fit it, even though he is a nutter.

[Daves]

If it weren't for the big initial outlay I'd do this tomorrow. And I'd get Solarman to fit it, even though he is a nutter.

It is not the outlay to me, the numbers should stack up in Qld, no problem. But I see the installs that have been in this area and they look f'n ugly as!

[Jarro]

It is not the outlay to me, the numbers should stack up in Qld, no problem. But I see the installs that have been in this area and they look f'n ugly as!

I saw the job, at a mates place, that the guy i'm going to use has done.

Top notch .... the reason i'm going to use him.

[jasonb]

jarro , what feed in tarrif is on offer in Qld, I managed to get locked in at 44 cents/kw for 25 years

[haysey]

This thread title should be changed to "Ask Solarman"

[Jarro]

This thread title should be changed to "Ask Solarman"

No, i think it would get waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy off track if we were to change the title to that ;)

[haysey]

No, i think it would get waaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy off track if we were to change the title to that ;)



Point taken:razz:

[Dcanto]

This thread title should be changed to "Ask Solarman" What about a thread title called "ask Wilson Golfbag". Wilson is on facebook, why not make him a member here too?

[goonie]

So what are true value solar and origin systems like? A PM is fine if you don't want to post comments in here.

[solarman]

Have a look at some forums and reviews on the net. I think the systems are ok it's just service type issues.

[Hawkers2008]

One upside of buying from Origin is that are ASX listed and a pretty solid company.

[goonie]

Have a look at some forums and reviews on the net. I think the systems are ok it's just service type issues.

True Value Solar just seem to be really cheap, they have a 1.5Kw system with 4.2Kw inverter (Growatt I think) for under $1900 (price is meant to double next month)

[Jarro]

True Value Solar just seem to be really cheap, they have a 1.5Kw system with 4.2Kw inverter (Growatt I think) for under $1900 (price is meant to double next month) That sounds too cheap to me.I'd stay away from that.

[Daves]

Somewhere on the Energex account, (ours is Ergon, so different), you will find what your daily energy usage is stated as kwh/day. Let me know what that is.

A 5KW system with good quality inverter and solar modules should be around $12K as it is competitive down your way. JUST STAY AWAY FROM THE CRAP STUFF.

Let me know what the gear is?

Origin are quoting (online) $15,990 for a Sharp 4.7KW system, sounds pretty pricey compared to others.


I saw the job, at a mates place, that the guy i'm going to use has done.

Top notch .... the reason i'm going to use him.

Wouldn't mind finding out who you are using jarro. Iwant to look at this in the next few months. Our power bills are getting to ridiculous levels.


jarro , what feed in tarrif is on offer in Qld, I managed to get locked in at 44 cents/kw for 25 years
44 cents for up to 5KW. Origin are offering an additional 6c in Qld.


Have a look at some forums and reviews on the net. I think the systems are ok it's just service type issues.

Which forums are best to look at Bob?, Thanks.

[goonie]

One upside of buying from Origin is that are ASX listed and a pretty solid company.

True Value seem to be pretty big as well, they have given millions in sponsorship to an ALF team if that means anything.

[peter_rs]

We have agl at 52c/kw

Sharp is a good unit.

The cheap deals are not bad if you can find the brand they use and can wait we were on a list for 6 months, then any 3 for the meter change (the floods didn't help)

[Grunt]

We lost the premium tariff here in NSW as it got too popular and the government would have gone broke if it continued to operate it. Is it a QLD government incentive up there to get higher than the actual power tariff for what you produce?

[Jarro]

Wouldn't mind finding out who you are using jarro. Iwant to look at this in the next few months. Our power bills are getting to ridiculous levels.The mob we're with are called Solar Green.

[peter_rs]

Gov backs 44c the rest is from the company

[Grunt]

Ok, I am getting 24 direct from AGL I think I pay around 18 at the moment for the power I use

[jasonb]

for those interested a link to my systems perfomrmance

http://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=9351

was only running 23 panels - 4370kw's for the first month, have just had the final 3 fitted - may need to relocate some as the neighbour next door has just put a carport on the fence line up which creates some early shading ( from 1pm)! we are below her property. Have had crap weather lately - cant wait to see what it can produce

[Pieface]

for those interested a link to my systems perfomrmance

http://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=9351

was only running 23 panels - 4370kw's for the first month, have just had the final 3 fitted - may need to relocate some as the neighbour next door has just put a carport on the fence line up which creates some early shading ( from 1pm)! we are below her property. Have had crap weather lately - cant wait to see what it can produce


Man you had some bad weather! I am paranoid about the neighbor going high and shading my panels!

http://pvoutput.org/compare.jsp?sid=1511&sid1=7584&t=m

[Grunt]

Man you had some bad weather! I am paranoid about the neighbor going high and shading my panels!

http://pvoutput.org/compare.jsp?sid=1511&sid1=7584&t=m

How does the system get your data or do you have to enter it manually?

[Pieface]

If you are savvy you can run PVbeancounter or similar and have automated updating to PV output in 5 or 10 minute intervals.

I am just dumping in the .csv files manually every few days when I have a few minutes spare.

[Daves]

I am in the process of getting quotes for Solar at the moment. Interesting exercise. I had no idea how inefficient the QLD scheme was. Whilst the pay back works, in reality the 5Kw limit means you can only every produce about 40% of your actual usage. There will be some surprised and angry people I reckon, when the feed in tariff drops back to normal in 2024 or whenever it is.

[Daves]

I am in the process of getting quotes for Solar at the moment. Interesting exercise. I had no idea how inefficient the QLD scheme was. Whilst the pay back works, in reality the 5Kw limit means you can only every produce about 40% of your actual usage. There will be some surprised and angry people I reckon, when the feed in tariff drops back to normal in 2024 or whenever it is.

Our system got installed last Thursday. So far looking good, averaging just on 30Kwh a day, yesterday was only 20 with a bit of cloud and rain about, most days has been 32/33. Hopefully will go higher as we move into summer. Same system is being installed on our Straddie place on Friday.

Anyone done anything with their Pool pump? New 5 star+, or added a Future Wave energy saver? Also looking at getting a guy in to look out our lighting, perhap replace with LEDs?.

[solarman]

Dave, what are the details of your system? That is amazing output for your area with a 5kw system.
Most data points to maximum 25kwh/day AC output for a system that size in Redlands.

[Daves]

Dave, what are the details of your system? That is amazing output for your area with a 5kw system.
Most data points to maximum 25kwh/day AC output for a system that size in Redlands.

Hi Bob,

28 x 200watt Suntech panels
1 x Aurora PVZ 5000

[solarman]

OK..that explains it a bit more...5.6kw in panels...extremely good output.

[Daves]

OK..that explains it a bit more...5.6kw in panels...extremely good output.

Yep, in 2 banks; 14 on north facing, other 14 on east facing. We wanted the install to be inconspicuous from the street. The Straddie install is going to be 20 x 280watt panels, all north facing, so it should really crank it out.

[timah!]

Dave, who did you use?

[Daves]

Dave, who did you use?

http://www.solargreen.net.au/

[timah!]

http://www.solargreen.net.au/

Cheers, will check them out...

[golfbound]

what do these systems normally cost Daves 28 panels is pretty big

[Daves]

what do these systems normally cost Daves 28 panels is pretty big

$13,700 for ours.

[Iain]

That's impressive Dave, ours got installed early June with the new meter done about a month later. A 3.3kWh system with 18x190w panels.

We're averaging around 16-17kWh a day (sunny obviously). We've put in about 150kWh more than we've used. So we're going to be miles ahead when we get a bill.

[golfbound]

thats great so what do you get a cheque back or just credit on your account

[Iain]

Not sure yet, get our first bill soon. I think it's just a credit on your account that you can get back if you want.

[Daves]

Not sure yet, get our first bill soon. I think it's just a credit on your account that you can get back if you want.

That is my understanding.

Have you also negotiated a discount in your contract Iain?

[Iain]

No, not yet Dave. We're still with Origin, may look at changing to AGL though.

[graham_w]

Its a credit. With AGL they are meant to be implementing an automatic system for cashing in your credit but you just need to call them until then and they refund to your bank account on file or send you a cheque.

We had a bank account on file as we paid a direct debit out of our account every month. Not sure how you give them your bank account details if they arent already on file.

[markTHEblake]

Daves. Did you have to pay extra to have the panel array split over two sections of roof. I think I will need to do that too for best results.

[Daves]

Daves. Did you have to pay extra to have the panel array split over two sections of roof. I think I will need to do that too for best results.

Not sure Blakey, only got one quote as we were specific on the panels not being readily visible from the street. Reality is though that only 14 panels could fit on the North facing section anyway, so was always going to be split, unless they all went on an East or West facing section.

[PeteyD]

What is the ROI like Dave?

[Daves]

What is the ROI like Dave?

About 25% p.a.

[PeteyD]

Dang. Is it declarable income?

[Daves]

Dang. Is it declarable income?

Interesting question, No for our residence, possibly for our rental property.

[Daves]

33 Kwh into the kick yesterday. A couple of stinkers coming up, so a new high hopefully about to be hit.

[Iain]

First bill received yesterday. Unfortunately the meter was only hooked up for 56 of the 91 days. But our bill is $5. So pretty happy with that and looking forward to the next one with the full time for the solar on.

[graham_w]

33 Kwh into the kick yesterday. A couple of stinkers coming up, so a new high hopefully about to be hit.

Youll actually find that high heat/no breeze day actually performs worse than a moderate heat/moderate breeze. A cool breeze allows the panels to work more efficiently. So a 35 degree day won't necessarily equal record breaking solar input.

[Hatchman]

Youll actually find that high heat/no breeze day actually performs worse than a moderate heat/moderate breeze. A cool breeze allows the panels to work more efficiently. So a 35 degree day won't necessarily equal record breaking solar input.

Yep, your all over it. It's all about the light exposure time without excessive heat reducing the performance. Seen some of our best numbers on 26-28 degree days.

[simmsy]

Loving our solar panels. Had them in since June last year and have been in credit since.

Big relief not to have that bill every cpl months.

[BrettM]

That's impressive Dave, ours got installed early June with the new meter done about a month later. A 3.3kWh system with 18x190w panels.

That's what we have had installed 2 weeks ago but with 200w panels. Just waiting for Energex to come out and tick it off so I can turn the bastard on!!

[Daves]

That's what we have had installed 2 weeks ago but with 200w panels. Just waiting for Energex to come out and tick it off so I can turn the bastard on!!

Why would they have to tick it off? The Installer should have turned it on as part of the install. Or do you mean install a new digital meter for future readings (rather than the old anologue meter simply running backwards)?

[BrettM]

Why would they have to tick it off? The Installer should have turned it on as part of the install. Or do you mean install a new digital meter for future readings (rather than the old anologue meter simply running backwards)?

I have a new digital meter already, but was told by the installers that Energex need to reset something as the power feeding into it makes the meter think we are using more power and not the other way around.

[graham_w]

I have a new digital meter already, but was told by the installers that Energex need to reset something as the power feeding into it makes the meter think we are using more power and not the other way around.

Yep. Some of the digital meters are unable to count export until they are reprogrammed. So they think that export is import and you get charged for all that glorious production :thumbdown:

[BrettM]

That was it Graham.

[BrettM]

And it is finally on. Loved watching that little arrow point in the opposite direction when it started up, until I fired up the house air-con to watch Bathurst :mrgreen:

Good to know though that a regular day for us will see us producing power, and that includes running 3 fridges.

[Daves]

Youll actually find that high heat/no breeze day actually performs worse than a moderate heat/moderate breeze. A cool breeze allows the panels to work more efficiently. So a 35 degree day won't necessarily equal record breaking solar input.


Yep, your all over it. It's all about the light exposure time without excessive heat reducing the performance. Seen some of our best numbers on 26-28 degree days.

They sure do love windy days, that is for sure. 38+ Kwh today! Pushing toward the first Megawatt generated. New meters go in next week.

[graham_w]

They sure do love windy days, that is for sure. 38+ Kwh today! Pushing toward the first Megawatt generated. New meters go in next week.

Yep. Ive got a 5kw system over west & north roof and got an all time high today of 29.968Kwh. Previous high was on Jan 1st this year. Great cold winds which kept the panel heat down and allowed them to chug along. Great day for solar!

[markTHEblake]

I had a 2kw system installed a couple of weeks ago. Still waiting for the meter change. Haven't really looked at figures yet.

[Mububban]

I had a 2kw system installed a couple of weeks ago. Still waiting for the meter change. Haven't really looked at figures yet.

Unless you've got a pool or a massive house with high energy consumption, I reckon 2kW would reduce your bills to bugger all. I've got a 1kW system and my normal bill is about $50 give or take. We have a 4 x 2 but are fairly low power consumers.

[Mububban]

Good to know though that a regular day for us will see us producing power, and that includes running 3 fridges.

Three fridges?!?

[TR66]

Three fridges?!? Thought that would be normal, food fridge inside,Beer fridge and lifestyle and spirit fridgeIn the garage.plus the tucker box freezer.Now I think about it there is only me and the cheese that's outta control.

[BrettM]

Three fridges?!?

1. Food
2. Beer
3. Wine

And yes, yesterday was excellent for power generation with the wind. Our output was higher than on a still hot day.

[markTHEblake]

Mate of mine has a 1 kw system and has $0 bills on average. The house is empty 6 daytimes a week and he and two kids really go hard at conserving use. Thus he picks up plenty of credit He also tested most things an said the worst thing for burning $ was the electric kettle and that the Microwave hardly uses anything in comparison to make a cup of coffee. My missus boils the jug about 300 times a day so I got to reeducate her. Should be easy ...,

[Daves]

I am in the middle of doing a power use audit for our place. I can only accurately measure where a power point is involved, but so far that will be a good 75% or more of our consumption. Things on standby alone are using over 4kwh a day. More than half of that is TV/Sound Systems.

[markTHEblake]

Dave what time of day do you get your max power?
I noticed the other day at 1pm I think I only got 1.2
Just now it's almost 1.6 on a 2kw system.

[Daves]

Dave what time of day do you get your max power?
I noticed the other day at 1pm I think I only got 1.2
Just now it's almost 1.6 on a 2kw system.

It would depend on where you panels face overall I would think. About 50% East, 50% North for us. I would say our peak would be around 11am. Ours is a 5kw system and maximum point of time output so far is 5.042Kw. Currently pumping 4.55kwh at 10.10am, and 13.2kwh produced so far today.

[Iain]

20.4kWh produced today, by far the best result I've seen from it.

[simmsy]

What size is ur system Iain?

[Daves]

What size is ur system Iain?

See below;


That's impressive Dave, ours got installed early June with the new meter done about a month later. A 3.3kWh system with 18x190w panels.

We're averaging around 16-17kWh a day (sunny obviously). We've put in about 150kWh more than we've used. So we're going to be miles ahead when we get a bill.


Mate of mine has a 1 kw system and has $0 bills on average. The house is empty 6 daytimes a week and he and two kids really go hard at conserving use. Thus he picks up plenty of credit He also tested most things an said the worst thing for burning $ was the electric kettle and that the Microwave hardly uses anything in comparison to make a cup of coffee. My missus boils the jug about 300 times a day so I got to reeducate her. Should be easy ...,

An electric jug would use around 2500 watts or so, but in very short bursts. Ours boils in about a minute, use it 20 times a day and it is still less than 1 kwh. Your desktop PC left on for 24 hours is probably using 2 to 3 kwh if you are using power saver mode, otherwise could be as high as 4kwh more.

36.6kwh for our system yesterday and it is maintaining the 30 kwh a day average for its 1st month.

[simmsy]

Cool yeah ours is 3.3kw with 4kw inverter. We avg about 24kw a day when sunny atm. We get up to 30 in summer. We haven't had a bill since installing and were still about $80 in front last bill. By the end of summer we will be several hundred in credit.

[timah!]

Iain, who did you use for your install?

Dave/Jarro - are you happy with the service/install you received from SolarGreen?

I'm keen to do this (not keen for the outlay) but would like to seriously consider it. Need to get some numbers to convince the wife though I guess...
We're starting to creep up a little in our bills (more than I'd like them to be anyway) so something to perhaps offset it a little would be good...

[IanO]

All of this is great food for thought but I am wondering whether or not it is as effective in Melbourne?

Our electricity bills are around $900 per qtr. If it costs $12 - $15K to get something decent installed, how long does it take for the system to pay itself off?

What size system is needed/practical?

[Jarro]

Iain, who did you use for your install?

Dave/Jarro - are you happy with the service/install you received from SolarGreen?

I'm keen to do this (not keen for the outlay) but would like to seriously consider it. Need to get some numbers to convince the wife though I guess...
We're starting to creep up a little in our bills (more than I'd like them to be anyway) so something to perhaps offset it a little would be good...

Mate i didn't go ahead with the system in the end :(

My friend who recommended them to me is very happy with his Solargreen experience though, very helpful and he's more than happy with the results his system is achieving.

[Iain]

Iain, who did you use for your install? RJay electrical.

[Daves]

Iain, who did you use for your install?

Dave/Jarro - are you happy with the service/install you received from SolarGreen?

I'm keen to do this (not keen for the outlay) but would like to seriously consider it. Need to get some numbers to convince the wife though I guess...
We're starting to creep up a little in our bills (more than I'd like them to be anyway) so something to perhaps offset it a little would be good...


All of this is great food for thought but I am wondering whether or not it is as effective in Melbourne?

Our electricity bills are around $900 per qtr. If it costs $12 - $15K to get something decent installed, how long does it take for the system to pay itself off?

What size system is needed/practical?

Yep, happy with the install and everything so far. I also got them to install a system on our Straddie place as well.

I guess the viability/efficiency of a system is going to be dependant on the orientation, and how many panels they can place on your roof. At the moment our system it covering our average historical usage. I won't know the exacts for sure until the new meters are installed (Thursday) and we get our first bill, but i expect to have wiped out our $800 per quarter bill at home and will be making serious credits on the Straddie place. I would suggest average payback is probably 5/6 years or thereabout, but ours is more like 4 years. There is a limit on size of systems that you can get rebates on in Qld (5Kw), not sure if that is the case interstate? Feed in tariffs also vary fairly widely I think.

The other part of the exercise for us is to audit our use and modify equipment, usage, behaviour etc to reduce our actual usage eg. replace pool pump with eco one, LED and CFL bulbs, use power saving modes where available, etc.

[Daves]

Solargreen have a web page on approximate system sizes needed and relative paybacks. Note this is based on Qld tariffs, rebates etc.

http://www.solargreen.net.au/systemsize.php

[markTHEblake]

I got 11kw yesterday on a 2kw system. Dunno if that's good or not I guess I need to see over longer term

[Mububban]

I got 11kw yesterday on a 2kw system. Dunno if that's good or not I guess I need to see over longer term

I had 5kWh on my 1kW system the other day (mostly sunny, some cloud, low 20s) so sounds about right?

[Daves]

Energex installed our new meter (flat rate domestic) yesterday. A quick online read plus a check of the MIL's bill, which includes solar, and I now have the hang of how they will bill us. For those that don't know, basically during the day your solar production at any time is used to 1) provide your power needs 2) any excess is feed into the grid. If solar production is not enough to cover your needs at any time, power is taken from the grid (e.g. at night). So you end up with 2 figures on your meter 1) net grid power used (01 on your meter) 2) net power feed into the grid (40 on your meter). If you also have a special rate tariff eg. off peak, your meter will have 3 figures I gather 1) (01) Net power used at normal tariff 2) (30) Net power used special tariff 3) (40) net power feed into the grid.

For each billing period you will get charged (GST inclusive);

1) Fixed supply charge $0.28787 per day
2) Net use at normal tariff at rate being 25.378c per kwh
3) Net use at special tariff, if applicable

less any discounts you have negotiated or are in your contract. Against that you will be credited for your net power to the grid. In Qld that is 44c/kwh plus your supplier bonus, in our case .06c/kwh Origin.

So it pays literally to move any discretionary power use to non solar production periods if you can. I have reset our pool pump accordingly, using discretionary power on rainy days will also help as well.

Based on my monitoring of our use so far, we should make a healthy credit overall. It also explains why you don't necessarily need a big system for it to pay, but if you have the roof area and the upfront capital, the economic return is quite attractive. It also explains why the government pulled the feed in tariff bonus back from the very attractive 44c/kwh it was up till July, to the now somewhat miserly 8c/kwh it is now.

[Mububban]

I've been checking my inverter when I get home at 4pm, it doesn't show 0.x partial units but it's been generating 5 or 6kwH this week, mostly sunny, scattered cloud, mid 20s. Yesterday's peak was 1018w of a maximum 1075w output.

[Pieface]

37.5 units yesterday for me. Temp will knock it back a bit today.

Looking forward to the next "bill"

[Mububban]

Latest power bill:

$20.70
Average daily units - 6
Average daily cost - 20 cents

Produced - 184 units @ 8.4c and 40c
Paid for - 341 units @ 22.6c, plus $22 supply charge, plus $10 gst

Shame we bought our system when it was so expensive, we used our baby bonus in 2008 to get a 1kW system and can't currently afford to buy extra panels. But getting a $20 power bill is always nice :D

[graham_w]

Whats nicer is getting a bill that's a credit of $532. :D

[Webster]

I'm considering getting a solar system put in, but not really sure where to start. Only really concerned with covering the amount of power that we use - we are on just under an acre, 30 square home, one fridge, one TV, etc etc. I've been monitoring our use which is between 8 and 13 kw per day depending on what appliances we use. I expect this to increase a bit in summer when we have the A/C on a bit more. We have gas ducted heating. The only things which appear to increase the daily use are the A/C unit and the clothes dryer.

We get a lot of sunny days down here, even in winter - it rains a bit, but we don't get long cloudy days like they do in Melbourne. Not sure what the rebates are like in Vic, but i think its pretty crappy.

What should I do (other than talk to Solarman).

Love, Jack.

[Daves]

Have you got that Pool Pump up and running yet Jack? if so is it in your 8 to 13 KW a day?

[Webster]

Nup

[Daves]

Nup

If you do plan to use it you will need to allow a few more Kws a day. Our is a 1hp motor and it uses about 5/6 kw a day running for 6/7 hours (50,000l pool).

[Webster]

Its only a little pool dave (above ground jobby). But point taken.

[Mububban]

Lately in Perth my 1kW system has been producing 5-6kWh per day. 4x2 home with evap aircon, gas hot water, old CRT TVs (only one on at a time, kids are only 2 and 4), lights go off when nobody's in the room etc. Even in the heat of the Perth summer when we run the aircon for 12+ hours a day, I don't think I've had a power bill over $75 since the system went in.

Solar systems are also half what they cost when we got ours, if we were purchasing nowadays we'd have gone for a 2-3kW system and be getting paid each bill, not paying out.

[Daves]

Its only a little pool dave (above ground jobby). But point taken.

Yep, but they do suck some serious power, as does AC and Dryers.

The size of the system you will need is dependant on your roof aspects and available space. My guess would be around a 3kW system, which should produce around 15kW ave a day over the year. Because the Feed in Tariff in Vic is only 8c now (plus whatever your supplier gives you, probably another 8 cents) you won't have a 1:1 match, so you will need to generate more than you use to get your bill to zero.

http://www.solarchoice.net.au/blog/3kw-solar-pv-systems-pricing-output-and-returns/

Once installed it is better if you use any discretionary items like Pool, AC and Dryer during the day so that you use your own generated power, rather than have to draw power from the Grid (at a higher cost price) as you do at night. For those that have the high Feed In Tariffs, the reverse it true.

[Daves]

Whats nicer is getting a bill that's a credit of $532. :D

Yep, that is about where ours is heading. If I change the Pool Pump to an Eco one (likely), substantially more.

[Jarro]

Yep, that is about where ours is heading. If I change the Pool Pump to an Eco one (likely), substantially more.

You haven't changed that pool pump yet ??

[Daves]

You haven't changed that pool pump yet ??

Not yet, been doing some monitoring of actual use and playing around with the timer settings etc to confirm what the actual savings will be. Plus have only had the new meters installed for a couple of weeks, so only now being able to calculate new power bill. Our motor doesn't use as much power as your old one did, but the numbers are still coming up at about about a $300 savings pa

[Chris32]

Got our first bill since our install, no import export meter yet so it's just been spinning the meter backwards. Our bill has dropped from around 500 a quarter to 130 bucks, happy with that!

[timah!]

Chris, what size system?
I'm still keen, but I am really only looking to reach a zero balance.

[Leon Phelps]

We are currently getting plans drawn up for our extension, and solar is high on my wish list.
Where is th ebest place to look for information?
I know nothing about solar, so any info is welcome.
We are in the Southern Highlands of NSW

[solarman]

The Clean Energy Council website and go into the Consumer Guide.

[Chris32]

Chris, what size system?
I'm still keen, but I am really only looking to reach a zero balance.

It's only a 1.5kw system, and we've had average conditions for producing power. Keen to see how it goes over the next few months. We just didn't have the roof space facing the right way and without any shadows to go anymore, we could have gone maybe two or three panels but we would have had to relocate our evap. cooler which would be a big hassle.

Pretty happy with it, its only a cheapie costing us around $2000 through a friend who runs a small solar company.

[Jarro]

Any of you guys been running the air-con since you've had the solar systems put in ?

I'm keen to see some numbers on this scenario.

[Leon Phelps]

The Clean Energy Council website and go into the Consumer Guide.

Thanks mate, I'll have a read

[markTHEblake]

Anyone converted anything to off peak other than hot water? I heard you can put anything on it , just so you realise it won't work between 6-10pm.

Thinking of doing the laundry and dishwasher. It would cost a few hundred top for the sparkiea work though

[Daves]

Anyone converted anything to off peak other than hot water? I heard you can put anything on it , just so you realise it won't work between 6-10pm.

Thinking of doing the laundry and dishwasher. It would cost a few hundred top for the sparkiea work though

I believe it has to be hard wired to go on Off Peak.

[markTHEblake]

I had my new meter installed 7 days ago. Just checked the reading and its 48/50/48 for power/off peak/feed in and don't take einstein to work out that's a credit so far.

[timah!]

Is that tariff33?
Our pool pump is on that. Hard wired and a pain in the arse.

[markTHEblake]

I believe it has to be hard wired to go on Off Peak. Not any more. You can confirm that on energex website somewhere. Read it last week.

[Daves]

Not any more. You can confirm that on energex website somewhere. Read it last week.

Found this, but seems to apply to Pool equipment only;

http://www.energex.com.au/residential-and-business/contact-energex/frequently-asked-questions/changes-to-pool-equipment-on-tariff-33-faq#39967

[markTHEblake]

Looks like I need to look at my browser history.

[markTHEblake]

Dave, I had read some of the pages in this google search result:

site:forums.whirlpool.net.au connect clothes dryer to off peak energex
I just skimmed it, a few people doing it, but upon reading it again you are right for qld. By the looks if we do it here it will have to be a shonky.

[Daves]

We just got our first quarterly bill where we had solar for the full period. Pretty chuffed, a credit of $566.

[golfbound]

How many panels yu got daves.

I just got a quote for 21 panels

21 x Norwegian REC 250W photo-voltaic modules
Roof mounting kit
Interconnecting solar cable
4 x DC circuit breaker
2 x DC marshalling box
1 x Grid connect inverter German SMA SB5000TL
1 x AC circuit breakers
1 x Ac cabling

Estimated Energy Output 5 kW
 Yearly energy yield ........................................... 8,158 kWh*
 Specific energy yield......................................... 1,417 KWh/KWp *
 Tonnes of CO2 reduction .................................. 8 Tonnes / year
 Renewable Energy Certificate entitlement ....... 103 RECs
 *Approx values only based on SMA design software and NASA Meteorology which is used as a guideline only. Variations can occur due to seasonal changes and climate change.

[golfbound]

dont know much about solar though... All I know is my bills are around $980 per 1/4

[Jarro]

We just got our first quarterly bill where we had solar for the full period. Pretty chuffed, a credit of $566.

Nice.

[Daves]

How many panels yu got daves.

I just got a quote for 21 panels

21 x Norwegian REC 250W photo-voltaic modules
Roof mounting kit
Interconnecting solar cable
4 x DC circuit breaker
2 x DC marshalling box
1 x Grid connect inverter German SMA SB5000TL
1 x AC circuit breakers
1 x Ac cabling

Estimated Energy Output 5 kW
 Yearly energy yield ........................................... 8,158 kWh*
 Specific energy yield......................................... 1,417 KWh/KWp *
 Tonnes of CO2 reduction .................................. 8 Tonnes / year
 Renewable Energy Certificate entitlement ....... 103 RECs
 *Approx values only based on SMA design software and NASA Meteorology which is used as a guideline only. Variations can occur due to seasonal changes and climate change.

We have 28 x 200w (Suntech) panels in 2 banks feeding a 5kW (Aurora) Inverter. Produces a bit over 30kW a day on average so far. Our installation was done to minimise the visualise impact of the panels. Hence the extra panels (half facing east, the others facing north).

[golfbound]

What was your bill normally before solar Daves if you dont mind me asking

[Pieface]

Sounds like you chew some serious juice BT! How many units a day do you average? 45-50 odd?

[golfbound]

im not sure just tv's aircon ducted fridges etc aircon does 25kw a day i think

[Daves]

What was your bill normally before solar Daves if you dont mind me asking

In the 12 months prior to installing Solar our average quarterly bill was $775 which equates to just under 36kwh a day average use. I have done a fair bit of work on our usage since the solar went in and we are now down to 27.5 kwh a day average and falling. I reckon it will bottom out about 25kwh a day average.

Air con will be your biggest user by a long way if you use it regularly. We have air systems right through the house (not ducted) and even the smallest system will use a couple of kWs an hour when on. We also have ceiling fans through most of the house thankfully. The next biggest users will be your refrigeration (assuming you don't have a pool) TVs if you use them for long hours and surprisingly desktop computers if they are on all the time. Halogen Downlights also chew the power collectively. I have replaced our Halogens with LEDs, but it isn't worth replacing most bulbs unless you use them a lot. CFLs are sometimes a better economic choice. I have some power meters that can measure accurately power usage for anything plugged into a power point. I also changed our pool pump to a new eco one and that has halved the pool usage also (saved 3+ kwh a day).

They have dropped the feed in tariff i.e. the amount they pay you for any excess power put into the grid from 44c down to 8 cents a kwh since we put ours on, so the economics has changed quite a bit also.

[sol381]

We are just about to do some major renovations at our place and thinking about putting in solar.. we missed out on the 44c feed in so are stuck with just 8c now...we are paying about 24c.kw so we will only get a saving of about 1/3 from a 5kw system..went to a website where they recommend solar and beacon solar came up.. they offer 8c + 20c if you change to diamond energy.. This only lasts 2 years tho....also in qld there is talk that campbell newman is getting rid of the 8c feed in july next year...if thats the case and suppliers are just obliged to give a tariff feed in then im wondering if there is any point in getting solar right now.....For a 10 grand system that only gives about $160 qtr saving, its hardly worth it....


im wondering how many solar comapanies will still be around in a few years as im sure less and less people will be installing..we are going to the home show next week to get some info but am still a bit confused as to the benefits vs initial outlay.

[markTHEblake]

I would wait a while now, the prices will have to start falling as less people take it up.

I got my first bill, $50 credit for the period of 35 days since it was installed (2kw) compared to my usual $370 a quarter. But that was a pretty good stretch of weather would be nice if they were all like that.

[sol381]

was thinking the same thing about waiting... do you have the 44c feed in tariff blakey? our normal bill is around $450 but with the extension it will more than triple the size of the house and we figure a 5kw system is the go.. as you say, just wait and see what prices are like later on in the year.

[PeteyD]

Can't understand why they paid that much for the feed in tariff, when it is 28c to buy?

[Pieface]

Sounds like I was pretty close with my guess BT. 8 cent FIT means you really don't want to be sending an awful lot back to the grid. Your system will pay itself off much quicker if you haven't spent dollars upfront that are paying back at a third of the electricity cost.

If you are serious you need to do at least a weeks worth of meter watching. Take a reading morning and sundown to work out what you are using while the sun is up and your night time use. That will give you a basis for starting to work out the size to go for.

[sol381]

how do you stop it going back to the grid?... everything you make goes into the grid

[PeteyD]

You can (at great expense) set up batteries etc so it doesn't even need to be grid connected.

[Mububban]

dont know much about solar though... All I know is my bills are around $980 per 1/4

That's more than I was paying a year BEFORE I got solar?!?!?

Do you have a pool? Teenaged kids running TV and computer 24/7? Extra fridges/bar fridges?

[Daves]

how do you stop it going back to the grid?... everything you make goes into the grid

Technically maybe, but that is not the way they meter it or bill you. They measure net used and net exported.

[Mububban]

For a 10 grand system that only gives about $160 qtr saving, its hardly worth it....

im wondering how many solar comapanies will still be around in a few years as im sure less and less people will be installing..we are going to the home show next week to get some info but am still a bit confused as to the benefits vs initial outlay.

It definitely sucks for anyone not getting the higher rate ie 44c or whatever. But surely most of us can make lifestyle changes to make dramatic differences in power consumption? All the stuff you see on the ads like getting rid of beer fridges, use the hills hoist instead of the electric clothes dryer, turn off lights not being used, open windows if you have a breeze rather than use aircon etc. We've got a little 1kW system supplying a 4x2 house, admittedly my kids are 2 and 4 not power hungry teenagers, but that said we consciously try to minimise power usage and it shows on our bills.

[sol381]

exactly right.. most of teh solar guys we have spoken to said that its ok to have panels on the roof but doesnt mean you can go crazy using power.. they recommend being a bit frugal and smarter with how you use power..as you should anyway.. power is just going to get more and more expensive so having solar and being energy conscious should keep more money in your pocket for more important stuff like golf clubs we dont need.

[Pieface]

You can (at great expense) set up batteries etc so it doesn't even need to be grid connected.

I've got about 8 years on the good FIT to go. It will be interesting to see how off grid stacks up by that time.

[PeteyD]

The 44c Tariff offer was ridiculous. Lotsa motsa to be made, if you ever get the credits paid out.

[graham_w]

The 44c Tariff offer was ridiculous. Lotsa motsa to be made, if you ever get the credits paid out.

No problems here.

I ring AGL every quarter after I get my bill and 2 days later the refund/credit appears in my account.

Only thing they could do to make it easier is have an option for it to be automatically refunded, but the 5 minute phone call every 3 months doesn't kill me.

[markTHEblake]

You can (at great expense) set up batteries etc so it doesn't even need to be grid connected.

and I dont think the batteries would last long enough for you to get a payback.


was thinking the same thing about waiting... do you have the 44c feed in tariff blakey?

You must be kidding, how the hell could i get a $50 credit compared to $120 charge over a month if it was 8c a kw with a 2k system! I am not even going to try to do the math :-)
I get 0.50kw

[Mububban]

having solar and being energy conscious should keep more money in your pocket for more important stuff like golf clubs we dont need.

Frugal becomes a dirty word in times of plenty but the grandparents used to grow their own fruit and veg, pickle leftovers, and save every penny they could. No coincidence that since the GFC little steps back to that mentality like home vegie gardens have become popular again.

If not for the environmental reasons, I'm surprised more people aren't a bit more green-minded simply because it saves you money that you can use on things you'd rather be spending on than bills!

[sol381]

mmmm, you know a simple "yes" or "yeah im on 44c feed in would have sufficed".. i have no idea what your usage is or if you were on 44c or 35c or 28c....need to relax a bit mate... i appreciate your input but your reply was a bit over the top.





and I dont think the batteries would last long enough for you to get a payback.



You must be kidding, how the hell could i get a $50 credit compared to $120 charge over a month if it was 8c a kw with a 2k system! I am not even going to try to do the math :-)
I get 0.50kw

[markTHEblake]

i appreciate your input but your reply was a bit over the top.

I said it with a smile! Thus by definition, I am quite relaxed.

[Daves]

Headlines in the local paper that Electricity prices are going up over 20% here this year. That would put the Tariff 11 up over 30c a kwh.

Found a couple of links that might be helpful for those looking at Solar options;

http://www.cleanenergy.qld.gov.au/demand-side/solar-bonus-scheme.htm?utm_source=CLEANEENERGY&utm_medium=301&utm_campaign=redirection

Found this bit in particular interesting;

Customers on the 8 cent tariff may be able to maximise their financial benefit by using the electricity generated from their PV system to power their home or business. Customers can discuss with their installer what size system best suits their needs. For a 1.5kW system, the average household will save around $350 on their annual electricity bill and receive around $50 per year in feed-in tariff payments. That's a total benefit of $400 a year with the 8 cent tariff.

The thinking needs to be somewhat the opposite of those on the 44c feed in tariff. In my case, I have tried to minimise power usage particularly during the day, and move any discretional usage I can to night time e.g. pool pump, cooking. Under an 8c (plus 6 or 8c from your supplier) feed in tariff, you are better off financially if usage is during daylight hours.

Here is a link with info of the various feed in tariff arrangements for all the states;

http://www.energymatters.com.au/government-rebates/feedintariff.php#fit-table

[solarman]

This is true. If you put too big a system in under the 8c FIT then you are feeding back at 8c and then they are charging you 25c when you get it back. This is why as an industry the push is too equity and it should be whatever the rate of power is eg 25c. Stuff the rbate just give a fair FIT.
If you have the 8c FIT, you should be looking at what your peak power at any point during the day is and then getting a system that will meet that requirement or at the least read your meter before and after daylight.
Most with 8c FIT are looking at 2 to 3 kw systems now whereas before with 44c they were getting the larger 5kw systems.

[goonie]

Anyone recommend a solar installer on the south side. Our new house has solar but the inverter is dead and the supplier has gone under so no warranty.

I have called Solar Green twice but they can't be bothered to call me back so I'm looking for someone else.

[Pieface]

Probably wise to budget enough to get the panels and wiring given a good once over when you get the inverter replaced Goonie. Your story reads a bit like a Western if you catch my drift :)

[goonie]

I hope not, I was told that energex have to check and sign off on all systems that feed back into the grid.

[graham_w]

Anyone recommend a solar installer on the south side. Our new house has solar but the inverter is dead and the supplier has gone under so no warranty.

I have called Solar Green twice but they can't be bothered to call me back so I'm looking for someone else.


Call Positronic at Brendale. They service all over the shop. Huge thread on Whirlpool about them (all good). They've done 5 houses of friends and relatives and all performing above expectations.

http://positronicsolar.com/

[Pieface]

When Western Power checked mine goonie they opened the meter box and they looked at the inverter on the wall. TICK!

Sorry mate, not trying to piss you off but with all the horror stories you hear about you may as well make sure it's working the best it can and safely!

[solarman]

Energex and Ergon only supply the new meter and make sure the volatges etc are okay. Beyond that they are not responsible for panels, cabling, inverter and installation. What brand inverter is it Goon man?

[goonie]

I'm only going on what the solar green receptionist said, because i queried the placement of the inverter inside the house in the WIR. She told me that was fine as long as a firewall was installed and energex would have checked it. She said the Technician would be able to tell me more when he called me, but he never did.

Sunna 5000

[goonie]

Pieface I intend to get it all checked out when it is repaired. It's all new to me and was already in the house when we purchased it.

[goonie]

Call Positronic at Brendale. They service all over the shop. Huge thread on Whirlpool about them (all good). They've done 5 houses of friends and relatives and all performing above expectations.

http://positronicsolar.com/

Thanks I will check them out.

[timah!]

So a bit of a bump for this.
We had our system go in a few weeks ago.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/08/06/hu4yzu6e.jpg

We had a 3kw system put in and so far I'm happy.
We've averaged 10.5kwh a day since install including all the rubbish weather. On a good clear winters day it's been a max of around 15kwh, so I'll be keen to see what it's like come summer.

I need to chase up AGL/Energex about getting the meters fixed up to feed back into the grid, but for now it's cool to see the dial spin backwards.

The other thing I need to do is work out whether I take to pool off tariff 33 or not. During the day I'm obviously generating enough to cover general usage, so to me I guess it makes sense to out the pool on during daylight hours and use the energy we're generating, rather than having that static charge continue. Might need to investigate that a bit more.

I know we won't really knock out our bill totally, but it'll go a long way towards it (particularly in summer I'd expect) and there are probably a lot more areas we can cut our usage down as well.

[Daves]

What feed in tariffs are you on Tim?

[timah!]

Will be 8c+8c Daves (govt + AGL).

[Daves]

Our pool uses about 3KWHs a day, it was about 6 per day before I installed an eco smart pump. Tariff 33 is about 19c vs your feed in of 16c, so not a lot in it on the surface. The downside of solar is the rainy/ overcast days when you wouldn't cover your usage and be paying full tariff. I actually run our pool pump/filter at night because we get the higher feed in tariff.

[golfbound]

leave it on spin meter as long as you can as they will be giving you 26c or so back rather than the 16c.

We got our first bill after having 22 panels installed. Our bill was normally around the $980 - $100 mark for 90 days this bill is for 72 days 60 of those with solar on and it was $344, so i think thats an ok saving can't wait till summer

[timah!]

Yeah, because we're the lower I'm trying to do everything during the day. Although the wife is still to get into that habit ha!
I probably need to check the tariff 33 rate and also see what sort of an impact it has had on our bill so far.
My wife thinks its funny that I've become a solar need though haha.

[Mububban]

We got our first bill after having 22 panels installed. Our bill was normally around the $980 - $1000 mark for 90 days this bill is for 72 days 60 of those with solar on and it was $344, so i think thats an ok saving can't wait till summer

Are you running a hydroponics lab to use that much electricity?!?!?

[golfbound]

no 3 lcd tvs and big ducted aircon on nearly all day and night.

[markTHEblake]

We got our first bill after having 22 panels installed. Our bill was normally around the $980 - $100 mark for 90 days

Do you have a 15 room house and leave the lights on all the time?

Before solar I paid $360-380pm for a 230m2 4br home for four people. no pool, no aircon, but 5000 computers, phones, ipods, chargers always on.

[golfbound]

yes lights alway on aircon on tvs and 3 pcs

[Dcanto]

Heavy use of a clothes dryer (especially during the wet season) will give you a quarterly bill like that also. :(

[timah!]

Heavy use of a clothes dryer (especially during the wet season) will give you a quarterly bill like that also. :(

I'd say that'd go for anything that heats wouldn't it?

[BrisWesty]

BrisWesty's "back when I was a lad" story

Solar is certainly easier these days than growing up off the grid just outside Ballarat. Dad built a mud brick house in 1983 back when he and mum were into Earth Garden and horticulture etc. We had solar panels connected to 12 deep cycle batteries. At one stage we had the panels on a sun tracker which was meant to follow the sun during the day.
Other applicances included a slow combustion stove for cooking and for heating the water. Pot belly stove and open fire for heating the rest of the house. Gas fridge. Even had a Coolgardie safe (ask your grandparents or some of the more mature members of ozgolf what it is) in the really early days we were there. 12V lights and appliances.

Ballarat is not exactly the sunniest place (even in summer), so winter was a bit of a struggle. Studied for my HSC by gas light because the power had run out. You could tell when the batteries were running out of charge because the TV screen started to shrink. When that happened, you'd start running the car, and put jumper leads onto the batteries to get enough charge in so you could finish watching the show or the movie.

I think we were on that system for about 10 years.

The folks are now on the grid, but some fond memories (and some not so fond)!

[Pieface]

Early adopters of Solar in WA got a nice kick in the nuts in todays budget.

[Mububban]

Early adopters of Solar in WA got a nice kick in the nuts in todays budget.

Yeah just heard, we used our baby bonus to get a 1kW system, back in the day it cost $5000 or so, figured we'd use the BB as it was "free" money anyway. Were hoping it'd pay for itself in 10 years as we're planning on staying put until we retire, the cut in tariff will set that ROI back but it was partially financial, partly environmental.

Ben, is your house very old/drafty to need the aircon/heating on 24/7? Or is it the clothes dryer scenario?
We just use our clothes airers indoors, even in winter clothes are dry within a couple of days and our washing machine is run all the time with the two young kids.

[timah!]

Just bumping this.
Our 3kw system hit a new peak output today of 17kwh, which is now exceeding my expectations. It will be interesting to see just what sort of output it will produce in the peak of long summer days.

[golfbound]

my house is a newer house just dryer running and i need aircon on most of the time due to my burns etc

OUr solar is doing about 30kw per day at the moment.

[Mububban]

my house is a newer house just dryer running and i need aircon on most of the time due to my burns etc

OUr solar is doing about 30kw per day at the moment.

I've heard that clothes driers are one of the most power-hungry devices in a home. We make do with clothes airers inside the house during winter :)

[timah!]

I've heard that clothes driers are one of the most power-hungry devices in a home. We make do with clothes airers inside the house during winter :)

Anything that heats is typically power hungry from memory.

[BroKar]

Hot water systems, pool pumps, dryers, air cons, ovens and lights, anything c that changes a temp.

Also what most forget is lights, buy some LEDs

[Daves]

Hot water systems, pool pumps, dryers, air cons, ovens and lights, anything c that changes a temp.

Also what most forget is lights, buy some LEDs

Power use is a combination of power draw (wattage) and time. Your electric kettle probably has the highest draw of any of your appliances. But it is only on for a few minutes, so power usage is not great. A pool pump is on typically for 6 to 8 hours a day, so whilst power draw is moderate (.3 to 1kwh) the time factor bumps usage right up there. Ditto your Fridge and Freezer(s). Relatively low power draw, but they can run for up to 18 hours a day.

Anything that plugs in, you can measure its power usage with a power meter, like these;

http://steplight.com.au/monitor/plug-in-electricity-power-meter/

LEDs are relatively expensive, so payback can be doubtful unless the light is currently drawing a lot of power, which usually means it is on for long periods. Areas such as kitchen, family etc, particularly downlights. For low use areas CFLs might be a more economic option. We replaced all of our downlights with LEDs and the odd bulb in other higher use areas with either LEDs or CFLs. Low time use areas we didn't bother. And you can buy LEDs on the Bay for about 25% of retail. You just need to do your research and be cautious of who you buy off, because some of the stuff out of China is very poor quality.

[Hatchman]

I just recently replaced all the down lights (7) in the kitchen with LED's. I mixed them up a bit with Phillips and Mirabela's to see if one dies before the other. I had trouble with a couple of spare halogens that were left behind when we bought the house crapping themselves within 2 months of replacing them. Gee they generated some heat.
The LED's run heaps cool and give off better light. Also got a couple of LED bulbs (Phillips) that I'm testing in the living area atm. I've been replacing energy savers at a rate of normal incandescent bulbs. They are supposed to last longer ppffftttt.

[FoxGolf]

Just wondering current thoughts/observations about solar energy systems?

We received a quote today for a 3kw system with a 3kw inverter. 12 x 250w Rene A1/T1 panels and a 3kw Afore inverter. At a cost of $3,200 installed.

We also got 2 quotes for a 5kw system.
(1) 20 x 250w Rene panels and 2 Afore 2.5kw inverters. Cost $5,400.
(2) 20 x 250w Rene panels with a 5kw JFY 3 phase inverter. Cost $6,000.

We were initially looking at a 3.3kw system with a 5kw inverter but when the sales dude came out to see us he realized we have 3 phase power to the house. Because of this he said anything over a 3kw system we need 2 inverters which are each connected to one of the 3 phases and therefore power from the 3rd phase will always be taken from the grid. Or we pay extra for a 3 phase inverter which transfers the power to each of the three phases.

We have received one bill in our new house where we used on average 42 units per day. That has gone up based on my reading of the meter today to about 55 units per day got the past 45 days.

Due to the configuration of our house we can get 14 panels north facing with any other panels east facing.

We've been told that we should generate on average 4.4 units per kw per day and therefore should save about $200 per 60 day bill. I.e. 3kw x 4.4units x 60days x 0.25c (cost per unit from the grid) = $198. Does this seem about right? I assume this only works if we use all of the power during the day that we generate. Based on our average daily usage I assume we would do so but what if we're out all day so no aircon, no tv, no lights, no washing machine etc. Does that mean we would put into the grid at 8c during the day, take from the grid at 25c at night and therefore save only 8c per unit used and not 25c?

Any thoughts welcome as I really have no idea about his stuff.

[Courty]

Just wondering current thoughts/observations about solar energy systems?

We received a quote today for a 3kw system with a 3kw inverter. 12 x 250w Rene A1/T1 panels and a 3kw Afore inverter. At a cost of $3,200 installed.

We also got 2 quotes for a 5kw system.
(1) 20 x 250w Rene panels and 2 Afore 2.5kw inverters. Cost $5,400.
(2) 20 x 250w Rene panels with a 5kw JFY 3 phase inverter. Cost $6,000.

We were initially looking at a 3.3kw system with a 5kw inverter but when the sales dude came out to see us he realized we have 3 phase power to the house. Because of this he said anything over a 3kw system we need 2 inverters which are each connected to one of the 3 phases and therefore power from the 3rd phase will always be taken from the grid. Or we pay extra for a 3 phase inverter which transfers the power to each of the three phases.

We have received one bill in our new house where we used on average 42 units per day. That has gone up based on my reading of the meter today to about 55 units per day got the past 45 days.

Due to the configuration of our house we can get 14 panels north facing with any other panels east facing.

We've been told that we should generate on average 4.4 units per kw per day and therefore should save about $200 per 60 day bill. I.e. 3kw x 4.4units x 60days x 0.25c (cost per unit from the grid) = $198. Does this seem about right? I assume this only works if we use all of the power during the day that we generate. Based on our average daily usage I assume we would do so but what if we're out all day so no aircon, no tv, no lights, no washing machine etc. Does that mean we would put into the grid at 8c during the day, take from the grid at 25c at night and therefore save only 8c per unit used and not 25c?

Any thoughts welcome as I really have no idea about his stuff.

Have a chat to Solarman next weekend. This stuff is his bread & butter (hence the name).

[golfbound]

Well we got our first bill from having the 21 panels on the roof and it came in at $170 so a big drop for the $1000 odd we were paying before solar. All 21 panels on my house are north facing.

[Iain]

Well we got our first bill from having the 21 panels on the roof and it came in at $170 so a big drop for the $1000 odd we were paying before solar. All 21 panels on my house are north facing.

$1000 a quarter?! **** me!

[LeftyHoges]

$1000 a quarter?! **** me!

Crazy right!?

Mine has just gone up over $300 a quarter and I'm pissed at that!

[Dotty]

$1000 a quarter?! **** me!
Due to his burns, I suspect Ben runs the aircon 24x7.

This also has the biggest benefit of solar, as his energy consumption is greatest when the sun is the brightest.

[golfbound]

Due to his burns, I suspect Ben runs the aircon 24x7.

This also has the biggest benefit of solar, as his energy consumption is greatest when the sun is the brightest.

Thats right Dotty Aircon 24/7 due to burns uses heaps of power

[jasonb]

I used to get $1000+ bills per 1/4 especially in summer when aircon on all day + pool running 10-12 hours. Had a 5kw system installed nearly 2 years ago & now only get a bill in the july-sept 1/4 (last one was $750)

here is a link to how my system works - it is out of date by a few days & the last couple of months I have just averaged out some figures
PV output is a good site to track how well your system is performing

http://pvoutput.org/statistic.jsp?id=9351&sid=7584

[simmsy]

who here cleans their solar panels?

how often?

how do you go about it?

[peter_rs]

Twice a year when I clean the solar hot water

Just hose.

[Daves]

Twice a year when I clean the solar hot water

Just hose.

Does it make a noticeable difference?

[simmsy]

My panels output has reduced they were very dusty.
Didn't really rain in Perth for about 5 months.
Have read of ppl cleaning them once a month. Thinking this might be worthwhile in Perth during summer months.

[peter_rs]

Less then 5% but everything helps

[golfbound]

mine get done every 6 months. The company that installed them do them for the next 2 years free of charge.

[Mububban]

My panels output has reduced they were very dusty.
Didn't really rain in Perth for about 5 months.
Have read of ppl cleaning them once a month. Thinking this might be worthwhile in Perth during summer months.

I'm overdue to give mine a good clean, last time I was up checking gutters mine were filthy. Haven't noticed any significant decrease in output on the live meter, or any larger than normal bills, but hopefully the rain since then has given them a good wash :)

[Daves]

How much are you guys paying to get you panels cleaned? No. panels/KW size? Do they do anything else? I am looking at pricing from the company that installed our panels, it is supposed to include a system and structure check. Based price is about $10 a panel, but that is for a single story place.

[solarman]

That Is cheap, a lot more expensive up here.

[haysey]

That Is cheap, a lot more expensive up here.



It's cheaper at Eurosolar...

[goughy]

So can anyone tell me about how these solar systems work these days (calling solarman). Had someone knock on our door today called Smart Gen Solar who unfortunately Rob gave my number for them to call. But it has got me wondering how systems work these days, in particular after this article popped up today http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2016/07/this-aussie-family-pays-59-cents-a-day-for-power-thanks-to-the-tesla-powerwall/

I'm guessing there's lots of newbies arrived on the market to be cautious of? These guys were telling Rob that paying off the system, with the money you save on your bill, won't really cost more than your current bill. And this power wall thing has had my interest since I first heard of it. Any new advice out there?

[goughy]

Should also mention, this is the website link on their business card
www.smartgensolar.com.au

[benno_r]

Bumping this one.

Looking to get a system installed - have a 2 story house so assume I'll be paying a bit extra. Getting some people out this week for quotes.

Any tips/traps etc I should be wary of?

[goughy]

We were all set to get one a few months ago, but wasn't able to get a green finance loan from anyone! Even though we had 3k cash to put towards it. We hadn't realised the Qld govt had a system in place to give 4.5k interest free loans to low income families to get solar, but the program closed the month before we started looking! Spewing about that.We were looking at REC panels as they have a 25yr manufacturer warranty when installed by an authorised dealer, and a fronius inverter. We got 6 or 7 quotes, but only two guys actually came out to talk to us. The others just priced it and predicted panel placement using Google maps. I felt everyone over estimated what we would save with the system. I worked out my own figures using average daylight hours for our area, which still showed it was well worth it. The prices we got varied quote a lot, and the system specs varied a lot too. But keep pushing them, as the one we were going with dropped his price to a couple of thousand under the next nearest comparable system.I looked at a site called www.solarquotes.com.au sure you can arrange some quotes through them, but they have lots of general info worth knowing.In the end it was for naught, but I learnt a bit.

[AndyP]

goughy, did you calculate how many years it would take for the energy savings to pay for the system?

[okitoki]

Bumping this one.

Looking to get a system installed - have a 2 story house so assume I'll be paying a bit extra. Getting some people out this week for quotes.

Any tips/traps etc I should be wary of?

had mine done around 7-8 years ago; even back then the rebate/solar buy back was getting pretty crappy... the calculation the sales person was showing me promised so much return that if worked out would pay out my system within a short number of years....

just be aware: (for me anyway)
- buyback is supposed to be based on excess at the time of usage, not the net difference per day (which most sales people used to say back then)
- bigger system is great if you have a number of background usages during the day; like swimming pool pumps, washing machines, a/c, someone at home using power, etc; reducing actual usage is worth more than buy back; I am not getting full use of it because no one is at home during work days.
- your output changes throughout the day depending on which way your panel is facing. so again, difference in usage vs generate varies
- depending on brand, the inverter will buzz when powered and can be really loud.... so make sure you get it installed in a place where it won't disturb anyone.... im sensitive to it, and it would annoy the heck out of me.
- watch out on China brand inverters; the one I had was pretty famous back then, but it died after 5 years (past warranty); by then the company I bought it from can't get replacement units in Australia anymore (they are big in Europe only); So at the end, I had to settle for a lesser brand after I threaten to write to ACCC about statutory warranty.

looking back, I probably should have selected a smaller system for a small household using a better branded system.

Currently system is still generating 2.4kwh; last billing period has been good with plenty of cool sunny days....

50617

[goughy]

goughy, did you calculate how many years it would take for the energy savings to pay for the system?Can't remember. I know that with the 3k cash we were going to put towards it, our quarterly electricity bill was going to go down by more than what the repayments for the green loan was going to be; I think we were looking at a 4 or 5 year repayment plan. Again, that's based on my figures, not what the solar companies claimed which were more generous. I think I worked out our based on 5.6 hours of daylight per day. It doesn't sound like a lot of hours, but that's averaged over the whole year, taking into account winter, clouds, rain (ha, as if it would rain), and the size of the system we were looking at. We also only have Ergon as our energy supplier, so we don't get great buy back rates, am restricted on how much we can send back to the grid, and a higher price for electricity. Move us 10km to Withcott and things would have looked even better!

[PeteyD]

Can't remember. I know that with the 3k cash we were going to put towards it, our quarterly electricity bill was going to go down by more than what the repayments for the green loan was going to be; I think we were looking at a 4 or 5 year repayment plan. Again, that's based on my figures, not what the solar companies claimed which were more generous. I think I worked out our based on 5.6 hours of daylight per day. It doesn't sound like a lot of hours, but that's averaged over the whole year, taking into account winter, clouds, rain (ha, as if it would rain), and the size of the system we were looking at. We also only have Ergon as our energy supplier, so we don't get great buy back rates, am restricted on how much we can send back to the grid, and a higher price for electricity. Move us 10km to Withcott and things would have looked even better!

Except for the fact that you would live in Withcott

[Timbo]

Does anybody have battery storage with their solar system?

I bought a house about a year ago that has panels which were installed when they offered the .60c Feed In Tariff (FIT). This has been great (getting power bills in credit), but I think it runs out in about 3 years. I assume that everybody will look at battery systems when the FIT deals expire, and hopefully the price will come down.

The little information and feedback I’ve got so far is that the current battery storage options are very expensive and I’m better off waiting for a more competitive market and better technology. Anybody have a contrary view?

[goughy]

That's pretty much the gist of it from what I've heard. Basically, you only bother putting on battery systems of money is no object. And from what I've heard, battery systems are usually not set up so you are using the battery when there's no power! You can check to be sure, but basically they are usually set up to be feeding back into the grid when your solar system is not generating! So in a blackout, you still have no power!
You'll really wanna double check that, bit that's what a got from other people advising me a few months ago. So in general, they're not worth the money.

One mate was saying they're looking at systems in the future where you can use your electric car to power the house during a blackout!

[BUSHY]

That's pretty much the gist of it from what I've heard. Basically, you only bother putting on battery systems of money is no object. And from what I've heard, battery systems are usually not set up so you are using the battery when there's no power! You can check to be sure, but basically they are usually set up to be feeding back into the grid when your solar system is not generating! So in a blackout, you still have no power!
You'll really wanna double check that, bit that's what a got from other people advising me a few months ago. So in general, they're not worth the money.

One mate was saying they're looking at systems in the future where you can use your electric car to power the house during a blackout!

This is a pretty good vid Goughy.

Unfortunately batteries aren’t a financial winner but the technology is there and it’s being used in some really good ways.


https://youtu.be/nWLzlrGGuxQ

[BUSHY]

I’m running a project at the moment where a commercial client on one site has pushed hard for some kind of battery integration even though we’ve tried to show the $$$ make no sense.

Sometimes the ideology of it is worth more.

[benno_r]

Had a few people out and had a few quotes made. Anything between $4500 and $8000, ranging from 4.9kw to 5.9kw.

Based on our usage, not going to save a tonne of money, but would allow us to run the aircon during the day during summer (which we currently might do 2-3 days a year).

I have no real ideological reason to do it, so it doesnt really add up. Might just run the air con all summer days for 9 or 10yrs for the $4500-$8000 instead.

[BUSHY]

Had a few people out and had a few quotes made. Anything between $4500 and $8000, ranging from 4.9kw to 5.9kw.

Based on our usage, not going to save a tonne of money, but would allow us to run the aircon during the day during summer (which we currently might do 2-3 days a year).

I have no real ideological reason to do it, so it doesnt really add up. Might just run the air con all summer days for 9 or 10yrs for the $4500-$8000 instead.

I’m sure you’ve done it but if you work it out what the actual cost is to run the AC units compared to the outlay you have you will likely point yourself in the right direction.

Do you have a pool? That might change things

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191210/4a4ade1127e14c757bc193a1a1fcfc38.jpg

[Timbo]

According to my last bill, the average daily usage in our house is 18.47kWh. However the power company also claims that this is greater than the average daily consumption for a 5 person household (16.1kWh).

We are a 2 person household for most of the week, with an extra couple of people for 2-3 days. How do we use so much more than a 5 person household?

Can someone please give me an indication of their daily usage so that I can determine if their average daily household consumption figures are unrealistic?

[benno_r]

I’m sure you’ve done it but if you work it out what the actual cost is to run the AC units compared to the outlay you have you will likely point yourself in the right direction.

Do you have a pool? That might change things

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191210/4a4ade1127e14c757bc193a1a1fcfc38.jpgNegatory, no pool.

We'd still only use the aircon a max of 30days a year, and we only set it at 25deg.

And considering Ergon only gives an 8c/kwh feed in price, it doesn't stack up for us. Our normal non-aircon usage averages 11-13kwh per day as is.

Maybe if I planned on living here for 15yrs, it might work out.

[BUSHY]

Negatory, no pools.

We'd still only use the aircon a max of 30days a year, and we only set it at 25deg.

And considering Ergon only gives an 8c/kwh feed in price, it doesn't stack up for us. Our normal non-aircon usage averages 13-15kwh per day as is.

Maybe if I planned on living here for 15yrs, it might work out.

And surely you won’t be there during the day for much longer [emoji6]

[benno_r]

And surely you won’t be there during the day for much longer [emoji6]Haha, yep. That too.

[BUSHY]

According to my last bill, the average daily usage in our house is 18.47kWh. However the power company also claims that this is greater than the average daily consumption for a 5 person household (16.1kWh).

We are a 2 person household for most of the week, with an extra couple of people for 2-3 days. How do we use so much more than a 5 person household?

Can someone please give me an indication of their daily usage so that I can determine if their average daily household consumption figures are unrealistic?

I work from home a bit while I’m home but other than that we’re an empty house during the day as a family of 4. Live in Cairns and the girls love the AC but we don’t really use it until November thru Feb/March.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191210/7096bfffd5afc974f8908b089fe62cb1.jpg

[Timbo]

Our usage still seems high then. Nobody home during the day Mon-Fri, AC only operates a few days per year, wood heater in winter.... something is not adding up.

[goughy]

See, in our case I work from a shed at home, and Rob is home full-time too. During summer there will almost always be one aircon on, 24/7. And a lot during winter. And because I'm home, I can run things like washing machine, dryer and dishwasher during the day.

Based on 4 bills, we use an average of 28.7kwh a day. And tracking our power usage over a week the split was about 43% during daylight hours. But with intelligent appliance usage I reckon I could have gotten that to 50% or more during the day.

That solar quotes site I think had some guides on how to track your usage effectively, including taking into account weekend days vs weekdays, because often their usage profiles are different.

[Daves]

Our usage still seems high then. Nobody home during the day Mon-Fri, AC only operates a few days per year, wood heater in winter.... something is not adding up.

The largest percentage of power consumption is usually driven via Pool, Air Con and Refrigeration. Washing Machines and Dish Washers use relatively small amounts as their time use is limited in comparison.Clothes Dryers will use lots if used regularly.

I use/used Power Meters to log our usage through out the house. LEDs will greatly reduce power use over old style halogens in down-lights etc, but only if they are used regularly, as was the case in our in a Kitchen and Family Room. I found lighting use/consumption elsewhere in the house was pretty low. I did not find TVs etc used very much power at all. Items like Kettle, Toasters and small appliances can use lots of power per hour, but are usually on for only a few minutes so relative consumption is low.

Back when we installed Solar in 2012 I did an initial power use log and made a few changes. We installed an Eco Pool Pump and that reduced the power consumption by 60% or about 3KWs a day. I replaced a dozen or so 50w Halogens with 3w LED. Other than that, it was long term things like buying energy efficient Refrigeration when replacements were needed that have brought our power consumption down. I keep a log of our power use along with Solar production etc and you could actually see the difference in the numbers when we replaced our old tech GE Frig with an Inverter Frig a couple of years ago.

[markTHEblake]

Can someone please give me an indication of their daily usage so that I can determine if their average daily household consumption figures are unrealistic?My average use is 16.1 on my previous bill 12.5. I also have a 2kw solar, No pool, no A/c, but a crappy HWS is half my KWH used

[goughy]

MTB reminded me, while we use 28kwh av per day, we have an instant gas hot water system, and has cook top! So that 28 is a lot, even with two of us home all day.

[Daves]

My average use is 16.1 on my previous bill 12.5. I also have a 2kw solar, No pool, no A/c, but a crappy HWS is half my KWH used

I forgot the HWS. We installed a Heat Pump HWS years ago and it uses bugger all.

[AndyP]

Can someone please give me an indication of their daily usage so that I can determine if their average daily household consumption figures are unrealistic?
4 ppl @ 22.28. No solar, no pool.

[okitoki]

Our usage still seems high then. Nobody home during the day Mon-Fri, AC only operates a few days per year, wood heater in winter.... something is not adding up. Well depends on what you have left on standby or running during the dayDo you have a pool?Do you have a fish tank that have constant heater filter light on?Do you have a network server and multiple NAS drive running?Beer fridge? Or a fridge that is in good working condition?Home entertainment sound system with great big amps?You have ducted ac?Gas or electric water heater?

[Benje]

how old are your fridge/fridges/freezers?

how old is your air-con? I hope it isn't an LG from about 2003. Ducted system,split, evaporative or ???

Average usage used to be 5000 to 6000 kWh pa, but is more like 4500 kWh these days with energy efficiency.
More if you have a pool, less if you have solar.

Benje

[Timbo]

No pool, very little AC use, solar power, We have an electric hws, but it is solar boosted. The fridge is about 10yo, and the beer fridge in the garage is probably even older. No computers, tvs etc are left on 24/7. A few months ago I dialled down the hws setting, thinking the hws was responsible.

Looks like I need to update the fridges, but I’m not sure they would account for the high usage numbers.

[Daves]

No pool, very little AC use, solar power, We have an electric hws, but it is solar boosted. The fridge is about 10yo, and the beer fridge in the garage is probably even older. No computers, tvs etc are left on 24/7. A few months ago I dialled down the hws setting, thinking the hws was responsible.

Looks like I need to update the fridges, but I’m not sure they would account for the high usage numbers.

Get a Power Meter and leave it plugged in for a few days. You will soon know how much power each one is using;

https://reductionrevolution.com.au/products/plug-in-power-meter?variant=28203487113&currency=AUD&gclid=CjwKCAiAob3vBRAUEiwAIbs5TnEo7dbCV6kIBR_dC75W 1KuZxEV8PjIaof8Mku6GOjM0PUl6qVALvRoChcAQAvD_BwE

[markTHEblake]

I forgot the HWS. We installed a Heat Pump HWS years ago and it uses bugger all. Been consideringone of these, is it connected to off peak?

[Daves]

Been consideringone of these, is it connected to off peak?

No, it plugs into a power point. Its a Quantum 315L. They have given us great back up. They replaced the whole system after about 5 years due to a faulty pump (more than 10 years ago now) and we have had no issues with it since.

[markTHEblake]

I think sales guy told me that they are more efficient if not connected to offpeak, but i am stingy :-)

[AndyP]

Get a Power Meter and leave it plugged in for a few days. You will soon know how much power each one is using;

https://reductionrevolution.com.au/products/plug-in-power-meter?variant=28203487113&currency=AUD&gclid=CjwKCAiAob3vBRAUEiwAIbs5TnEo7dbCV6kIBR_dC75W 1KuZxEV8PjIaof8Mku6GOjM0PUl6qVALvRoChcAQAvD_BwE
Thanks for the link, Daves. I have been looking for the old meter that Energex supplied ages ago, but it must have died and got chucked out at some stage, although it didn't track individual devices.

[okitoki]

how big is your beer fridge? full size normal fridge?

That would be a electricity sucker there since most households usually have only 1 fridge...

[Daves]

I think sales guy told me that they are more efficient if not connected to offpeak, but i am stingy :-)

It would be a cheaper per Kwh rate, but it would have to be hard wired into the Off Peak system, which wasn't practical when it was installed. And Off Peak also restricts the hours it can operate.

[Timbo]

Thanks for the tip on the plug in power meter Dave, I will definitely get one, I didn’t even know there was such a thing. That should give me some answers or at the very least eliminate a few things.

[Benje]

I think sales guy told me that they are more efficient if not connected to offpeak, but i am stingy :-)

Heat pump hot water works by transferring air temperature outside into the water via energy. The warmer the air, the less energy used by the heat pump. They are terrible when the air is freezing, and really efficient during the day when the air temperature is higher.

If you have any cheap daytime power prices eg solar sponge then run the heat pump then - it will use less energy and it will be at a low price.