Ruling?

[ParMaster]

I have 2 questions:

1: I recently acquired a TENS Machine which I find helpful for my pain. Is it legal to use such a device during a competitive game of golf?

2: The other day I was playing golf (obviously:roll:) and I couldn't mark my ball back down. When trying to replace my ball it kept moving off the spot. So what is the ruling here if the ball will not stay where your marker is?

What are the rulings fellas?

[Johnny Canuck]

2 is the closest point (not nearer) where it will stay without rolling.

1 - pretty sure you could as it is not a training aid. just don't delay play while using it.

[Minor_Threat]

What is a TENS machine?

[ParMaster]

It's a machine that sends little electric charges to the spot where you've placed the pads on your body. It increases blood flow in that area and relaxes the muscles.

[Webster]

It increases blood flow in that area and relaxes the muscles.


You should just have a wank before teeing off.

[WBennett]

Puppet

Are you playing in the Schoolboys champs in Canberra this week?

[Johnny Canuck]

You should just have a wank before teeing off.


Puppet

Are you playing in the Schoolboys champs in Canberra this week?

Are these posts related?

[Scottt]

If you are in significant-enough pain that you need a TENS machine, you shouldn't be playing golf.

[ParMaster]

Thanks for the helpful advice Scottt.

Golf is what I love. I have been playing it for 13 years and there is no way I will stop playing untill i either A: Die or B: Am physically unable to.

Now answer my question as to whether this is legal or not.

And wbennett No I am not.

[Johnny Canuck]

B might come a bit sooner if you don't take care of things first.

Seriously. What Scottt says makes a ton of sense.

Take it from someone with an extensive history of sporting injuries.

[ParMaster]

There is no way I'd give up golf. End Of Story.

Does anyone know if using a TENS machine during a game is legal? It's an electronic device.

Guess i'll just have a look in the rule book..

[Johnny Canuck]

Look it up, great idea. You should have done it in the first place.

I already told you it is most likely legal as it is not a training device or anything of that nature. As long as it doesn't slow play, you should be fine.

As for your first comment, spoken like a true, immature, idiot.

If your back gets stuffed, you may have to give up golf, you may not be left with a choice. Get it looked at, treated, etc, before it gets to a point where you can't swing a club. Look at your golflink record. I don't think your back is helping things at the moment. There is no way someone of your ability should be dropping into the 80s on a consistent basis.

Would you still love golf if your back was so bad that you had to play every round in severe pain and couldn't break 90?

Sometimes a small break can make a world of difference.

When is your doctor's appointment? A TENS machine isn't a long term fix.

[virge666]

There is no way I'd give up golf. End Of Story.

Does anyone know if using a TENS machine during a game is legal? It's an electronic device.

Guess i'll just have a look in the rule book..

Ahh . . the youth of today. I was this dumb once.

Geez I miss it.

[3oneday]

Is wanking illegal now too ?


I think this thread has confused me.

[Scottt]

Thanks for the helpful advice Scottt.

Golf is what I love. I have been playing it for 13 years and there is no way I will stop playing untill i either A: Die or B: Am physically unable to.
.

I wasn't saying give the game away, I was saying that as a 15yo 1 handicapper, it's in your long-term interest not to compound and injury to a point that it will threaten your career by playing through it.

Have some rest, get some physio and or chiro and get better. You are doing nothing positive for your body or golf game by playing when you are in extreme pain.

There are three body parts you never take risks with IMO: your back, hamstrings and achilles. None of them ever heal right and will always linger with problems.

[Minor_Threat]

I wasn't saying give the game away, I was saying that as a 15yo 1 handicapper, it's in your long-term interest not to compound and injury to a point that it will threaten your career by playing through it.

Have some rest, get some physio and or chiro and get better. You are doing nothing positive for your body or golf game by playing when you are in extreme pain.

There are three body parts you never take risks with IMO: your back, hamstrings and achilles. None of them ever heal right and will always linger with problems.Ditto to this.. Injuries were one of the reasons I gave it away fulltime!

You have your whole life to play golf mate, get it sorted now and you will will have a lifetime to keep playing! Stop being a softcock and get it looked at..

[Grunt]

have to agree on the hamstring one. I tore mine once and I still get twinges in it occassionally now. I have to be very careful when pushing it to the limit.

[virge666]

Nice one Scott and MT - couldn't agree more.

If you need a TENS machine - you need help.

[Grunt]

is starting to happen too often but I agree with scottt too. ;)

If at 15 you are having to use a machine that 50 year old may need, you need to take up another sport.

Fix the cause of the problem not the result.

[parlyboy]

Parmaster i was in the same positon as you when i was your age. I gave golf up at 16 due to too much golf and chronic back pain.
I then started drinking and doing grotty things to girls that i knew i should not have been.
IT was then fairly obvious that golf took a back seat for 10 years or so.

Take the advice from these blokes put the sticks away for a month or so at least.
It will all come back to ya with a few hours of practice.

Oh and as for your questions.
1. ?
2. What cunuck said.

[ParMaster]

Fair enough points by all.

Thank you all for your input.

JC my doctor said she will get me into some program that gives me 5 free sessions at a sports physio. But that won't happen for another month or so..

[Johnny Canuck]

Just take it easy with the back. If it is really killing you, there is no point fighting through the pain to go out and shoot 86. Risking long term damage isn't worth it. Better to miss a couple weeks than it is to miss a couple months or even a year!

And no matter what anyone tells you, don't hook the TENS machine up to your nutsac like they did on Jackass.

[ParMaster]

Damn. :mad:

:lol:

[Fishman Dan]

You could always adjust your swing in a way that would mean you don't get pains while playing. There's a few 65+ year olds at my course who could teach you.

I'm sure lessons would be cheap too.. $20/half hour, and a middy of old at the end - are you old enough to buy beer?

[zigwah]

Why are you using a tens machine?

[ozdevil]

Parmaster

there is one thing in life you can not fix entirely properly in life is your back once it has been bent it will not return to its normal self

you only have 1 back in yalife you need to look after it properly and what has caused your back to be in this position it is today? you can not replace ya back once it has gone it is gone for ever

but golf is still going to be there in a months time or 12 months time depending how long it takes to heal your back so your not feeling pain no longer

parmaster I used to love playing rugby union played the game for years but one saturday afternoon i was going in after the ball and got the biggest knock of my life i thought nothing of it as i didnt want to give up playing rugby so left it about a week or so and i was in a bit of pain and i still do have pain from that day.....

I went to the doctor and he said to me how did you recieve this bruise i told him i had a pretty heavy knock a few weeks back playing rugby.. he said i am sending you of ultasound and x rays

the ultra sound picked up my left kidney had died and has shrivel up to the size of golf ball

he said prepare for the worse case senario and that is i may have to go a transplant and spend some time on dialysis and the proceed to right me out a referal to a kidney specialist for more testing where they placed a camera you know down the old snake and few other test

anyway it was revealed that i have lost my left kidney and they wont remove it becuase it isnt hindering my body at all and my right kidney is compensating well with the loss of the left kidney

I was told never again to play contact sport again that really hurt me becuase the love i had for the sport...

but i am now happily living a normal life as you and others are the only difference is i only have 1 kidney...

so the point i am making like others it is best to do something early before it gets worse you will be much better for it... me i had no choice when i recieved that knock i couldnt control the loss i had to my body even if i had of seen the quack in the first instance..

cheers
ozdevil

[henno]

Why are you using a tens machine?

Considering the word "back" has been used only about 20 times in this thread, I'd say it has something to do with his back. :-k

[Yossarian]

I wasn't saying give the game away, I was saying that as a 15yo 1 handicapper, it's in your long-term interest not to compound and injury to a point that it will threaten your career by playing through it.

Have some rest, get some physio and or chiro and get better. You are doing nothing positive for your body or golf game by playing when you are in extreme pain.

There are three body parts you never take risks with IMO: your back, hamstrings and achilles. None of them ever heal right and will always linger with problems.

What he said.

And what Jack off said.

[ParMaster]

Fishman i'd say it does have alot to do with my swing. I really do swing hard at the ball and unlike most people where most of their weight transfer is going forward, I think i am moving backwards and leaning back at impact. (With my Driver) That's why I hit it very high.

Yes it's mainly for my back but that is not the only place I use it.

Ozgolf i'd say what has caused it would be my posture while sitting down and my Golf swing.

I don't really want to take a break from golf. We'll see what the physio says in a month or so. (Man i wish they'd fkn hurry up)

[Johnny Canuck]

do you do any stretching? it can go a long way.

[Yossarian]

Has anyone made a sore back-puppetmaster's boyfriend type joke yet?

Stop recieving and start giving PM. ;)

[idgolfguy]

You should just have a wank before teeing off.
Wouldn't that over stress your wrists before a round?

[ParMaster]

do you do any stretching? it can go a long way.

No whatsoever.

[Ned]

PM,

For a ruling, contact either your District or State Organisation.

For your injuries, contact an accredited Sports Medicine professional.

Everyone has choices, unfortunately some make poor ones rather then good ones.

[LarryLong]

There are three body parts you never take risks with IMO: your back, hamstrings and achilles. None of them ever heal right and will always linger with problems.

None of those three would have made it to number one on my list. :)

Pup, if you're not stretching and you're then throwing yourself at the first drive of the day, that's a recipe for disaster.

[henno]

I couldn't play with a dodgy back. One round at Nudgee a couple of weeks ago was bad enough, after pulling something on the first drive. No thanks.

[Dotty]

Parmaster, from the 'week commencing' threads, you are frequently shooting 10 over handicap. And in pain. And keep playing.

Find another interest.

It's not hard, I've done it a couple of times over the last 15 years, through injury and other circumstances. (Doesn't have to be sport. Earlier this decade, I was spending my free time making furniture in the backyard.)

Anyway you should be spending the next 5 years studying, getting a useful HSC grade and a foundation for life. Especially as a career playing golf is becoming further out of reach.


As for a ruling, you may need a 'Casey Martin' exemption from the state association. :)

[zigwah]

Considering the word "back" has been used only about 20 times in this thread, I'd say it has something to do with his back. :-k

Back can mean a lot of things and no one has actually asked what the dr said it was or where the pain is.

I can guess that he hasn't had an xray or MRI and that his physio most likely thinks it is soft tissue damage.

A tens machine is used in an at home situation to inturrupt pain messages from the brain, it is not a way too fix your back.

Since there is also not much other info, i would guess you really have no idea what is wrong with your back, and that really could spell bad news when it comes to your long term sporting ambitions.

So since "the back" has been mentioned so often, no one has any idea what is wrong the first question should be, why are you using a tens machine :-k

As for a ruling i would say the ruling association would ask the same questions and based on info they would probably think, if your stupid enough to do it, go for it.

If you want some advice on how to deal with pain, i can help you, flipant comments can really do no good sometimes

[Johnny Canuck]

Flippant comments?

We're trying to help the guy Ziggy. There haven't been any flippant comments really made at all. Maybe a few in jest.

Before you get on that high horse, read the thread. You would see that he is awaiting his doctors appointment.

I'm sure you can offer him some helpful comments, but this is the second time that your have jumped to conclusions and made assumptions in this thread, when the answers you seek are all there if you would bother to read.

[zigwah]

there are no answers there?

[Yossarian]

Buy the wedges.

[3oneday]

$20 shipping ?

[Yossarian]

You didn't hurt your back in a freak buggy accident did you PM?

[petethepilot]

Parmaster,

If you are tearing your back up at 15, what you are doing now does not bode well for later years. I too hurt my back in my teens whilst playing good golf (on the verge of the state junior team). To fix it I did the following:

1. Take at least a month or 2 off golf (if you can't at least limit yourself to short game);

2. Seek some medical help to correct (not mask!) the pain;

3. Start a stretching routine/yoga that you do religiously. Maybe even a weights/gym programme targeted at golf;

4. Have an expert look at your swing and determine what is causing your back problems. I bet you have a compression of the right side, a big leg drive and something resembling a reverse C finish. Look at the modern swings. Most have an amount of lateral coil going back, a rotate through the ball to a straight back finish (Nick Faldo/ Tiger/Adam Scott are great examples). That swing will remove the cause of your back problems and allow you to play better golf. I certainly did!

Your body is trying to warn you. A tens machine is just a way of fooling your bodies defence mechanisms.

Good Luck,

The Pilot

ps, I think rule wise, that machine is just like taking panadol, therefore legal (just not smart!!!)

[idgolfguy]

PM,

For a ruling, contact either your District or State Organisation.

For your injuries, contact an accredited Sports Medicine professional.

Everyone has choices, unfortunately some make poor ones rather then good ones.

If it is your swing that is causing your back problem(s), ensure that the golf coach is giving you a swing for longevity. If it changes how you swing so be it - you'll adapt. If you're a 'bomb and gouge' player, this will add another dimension to your game and actually make you a better player.

All pros do the right thing so that they can keep playing.

[Johnny Canuck]

what pete said is all very good.

if you are going to start a weights routine, make sure it is designed by someone with knowledge of your back issues already.

like both zig and pete said, hiding the pain is a terrible way to handle it. you'll only be able to hide it for so long until it becomes unbearable. get to the root of the problem. if it ends up that you need to take a month off, be smart about it.

one month off could end up meaning years of successful golf.

just think how much you can improve your short game if you have to stop swinging for a month!

[Dotty]

We covered the gym and weights issue with Parmaster a couple of months ago in the 'Why aren't I improving thread?'.

It seems a common thread ... Don't follow the conventional route of a golf coach and/or the NSWGA junior's program (or pick up a rule book). Ask for advice online from golf 'hobbyists'. Then tell the respondants that their opinions aren't right.

[ParMaster]

Dotty, I am entitled to ask for an opinion.

Good advice pete. It probably is best to take some time to recover but I don't really want to stop golf. (Although I got a little chip-chip course in my back yard. :))

Anyway I did have X-rays done 4 months or so ago. It showed that I have a bulge in my lower spine and a thinning of the plates towards the top of the spine.

Is that a really bad thing?

[Johnny Canuck]

That doesn't sound good at all. Go and see a specialist.

Things like that can lead to major surgery and could leave you in a state where you will NEVER golf again.

Stop this "I really don't want to stop golf" bullshit before you permanently damage your back. You seem to be conveniently ignoring this point every time someone says it.

Think long term PM. You're young, you think you are indestructible. This is not the case.

Do you think anyone that gets injured wants to stop playing sport? Do you think Goonie wants to take time off for his wrist? Sometimes you have to for things to heal.

Go see a specialist, end of story.

[Grunt]

What did the docs say 4 months ago? If I had that sort of damage to my spine at my age I would be shitting myself. At your age I would almost be suicidal. Your back is almost the most important part of your body.

[Russ]

Stop this "I really don't want to stop golf" bullshit before you permanently damage your back. You seem to be conveniently ignoring this point every time someone says it.


Was thinking the exact thing.

PM ... you need to wind your neck in. You're 15 and you've got problems with your spine.

Stop playing/practicing golf. Tell your parents what's going on. Go get professional medical help.

[Tongueboy]

surely the parents know? they should smack him under the ear and force the issue.

end of story

[zacdullard]

Think long term PM. You're young, you think you are indestructible. This is not the case.
I thought all young kids are 6ft tall and bulletproof?

PM, you should go see a specialist. You don't want to stop playing golf now, but by not giving your back a rest now you are potentially stopping yourself from playing for the rest of your life. I think that would be worse than a short time away from the game at the moment to let your back get better.

[Johnny Canuck]

PM, when I was a little younger than you, I partially tore my MCL (knee ligament) and elected not to have surgery. My parents were away when it happened so they never found out the severity of my injury.

I never missed a single ice hockey or basketball game during the recovery.

I limped for over a year as a result.

When I was a little older, I thought it was smart playing 5 ice hockey games in 2 days after partially tearing the same knee ligaments in the first period of the first game.

I love the aches and pains that I get now as a result. I'm also pretty sure it contributed to me doing it a third time.

I learned the hard way. Broke my thumb playing ice hockey. Came back a little early, threw a check and broke it again.

Where I could have waited a couple more weeks and healed properly, I came back early and ended up missing the remainder of the year.

These are both VERY MINOR compared to what you could be dealing with, but they should provide a clear enough example for you.

Your body is your most valuable asset. You only get one. Don't **** it up.

[ParMaster]

Of course my parents know whats going on.

And I have been thinking long and hard about stopping golf for awhile and I think that is my best bet. Would limiting my golf still have the same results?

[sms316]

Would limiting my golf still have the same results?

No dipshit. It will only prolong the agony, and never give the injury a proper chance to heal.

[ParMaster]

Dipshit? WTF

[sms316]

Dipshit? WTF

You don't know what a dipshit is?

:-s

[zacdullard]

Dipshit. (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dipshit) I am suprised that this is in the dictionary, I didn't think that it was an actual word.

[Russ]

You don't know what a dipshit is?

:-s


I think it was a "why call me dipshit?" not a "what's a dipshit?"

:mrgreen:

[ParMaster]

Bit of both actually Russ. ;)

[Johnny Canuck]

No dipshit. It will only prolong the agony, and never give the injury a proper chance to heal.

Good answer.

Think about it PM. Do you really need to ask that question?

[ParMaster]

Yes.

I am taking time off but there is this 1 event i'd like to play in a couple of weeks. But yeah, I'm gonna be golf free for awhile.

[Johnny Canuck]

See how your back feels in a couple of weeks.

Do some stretching exercises and warm up thoroughly before that event.

If you start to feel pain, you are probably undoing all of the healing that you have done.

Think about the analogy of a cut on your arm. It won't heal if you poke at it everyday. If it starts to heal and then two weeks later you decide to poke at it for 4 hours, chances are, you'll be right back where you started or worse.

[ParMaster]

Boy this is going to be a tough couple of weeks. :(

Worth it in the long run i guess.

[WBennett]

Weeks? Try months.



Dipshit hey SMS? You learnin Queerslander good already huh?

[zigwah]

Has anyone explained to you what happens when a bulging disc explodes?

[ParMaster]

Nope.

[Tongueboy]

if the golf doesn't work out I suggest you start watching old episodes of Ironside

[ozdevil]

Parmaster

i think you are doing the right thing now by giving it all a break and realising that this is not going to be a quick fix...

it may be a slow steady pace back into golf but you may well be back better then you was before

cheers
Ozdevil

[markTHEblake]

Parmaster, i have no doubt that your machine is within the rules. It no differnet than someone wearing a knee brace.

However if that person was wearing the brace to aid his swing, and wasn't for injury prevention or management that would be against the rules, although hard to prove.

In any case I would write a letter to your golf club and ask for a ruling, and they can contact the state on your behalf - it is the proper protocol to go to your club first.

Oh, and obviously your parents have abandoned you and you are living on your own now and cant afford to see a doctor, lucky you have everyone here to give you the guidance you are missing out on.