The new handicap system

[jumbuck]

I have complained to Golf Australia (Simon Magdulski) that the new handicap system that uses only the best 8/20 of our rolling scores then multiplies that by "the bonus of excellence" .93 then multiplies that by your course slope and divides by 113 (ave slope) creates phoney handicaps that are very difficult to play to. Consequently it is ruining the (my and other Blackwood members) enjoyment of golf which is the main objective of Golf Australia.
The reasons to change from the former CCR (regarded as a very good system for 90% of fields) are confusing.
1) It was not suitable for small country and ladies fields as a few high stableford scores distorted the CCR. (So what)
2) When conditions are particularly tough (cold wet and windy) some players wouldn't go out in case they had a bad score which would adversely effect their handicaps (this was .1) not a lot to worry about?
3) According to Simon M. there have been numerous complaints. In Adelaide I know many golfers from different clubs who talk and whinge about many things but not this.
4) The change from 10/20 and .96 to 8/20 and .93 was because of more complaints that it favoured high handicappers v low handicappers. The major clubs in SA have A,B and C grade. A graders don't play against C graders. For those smaller clubs that do I'm sure the millions of dollars spent on this new system ( that engaged brilliant mathematicians and course experts that SLOPED each course) could have worked a formula for them. I presume A B C is the norm for most clubs?
One reason that few complain is a lack of understanding that when they shot 85 off the stick Simon Magdulskis formula instantly turns it into 83. WHY? Because that is your potential and that is the score you should have got! Secondly Aussies are too slack, lazy and generally can't be bothered on mass to get off their collective "you know whats" to complain.
Potential v Ability. I think it needs to be made clear that the day the 10 handicapper shoots a 75 a fair amount has had to go right. Lots of putts going in 3 or 4 or 5 chips going close etc. This is then counted as the norm (potential). What it is is luck, fluke the planets aligning. If it was ability then why wouldn't he shoot more scores in the 70's?.
One of my conclusions is that there are 2 main types of golfers. The 1st (in no particular order) strive to lower their handicap whenever they play and love this system as they can play ordinary golf with little effect on their handicap. They of course can brag that they play off 7 even though the last time they did was so long ago they can't remember.
The 2nd group (my guess is the majority who have long given up the grand illusion of winning a major and realise the crappy golfer they are with faults they can 't identify) who wouldn't mind a few extra strokes in winter when conditions are tough.
Would love some feed back. If you think I'm pathetic fine - I'm used to criticism as I'm married!!

[Dotty]

Easy fixed. Just start your own competition.

It worked a gem for Kerry Packer in 1977.

[3Puttpete]

I don't know if I agree or disagree. I don't even know if I understand it but that's the a decent first post. Welcome.

How does 85 automatically become 83?

[LarryLong]

I wouldn't want Simon's job for all the world, because I doubt you could ever come up with a system that would keep everybody happy. I like the current system. I think it goes as close to meeting the stated aims as anything I could think of, and I'm sure the statistical boffins at golf Australia know better than we do how well it is doing on a grander scale.

I think Golf Australia probably spent too much money on implementing the system, but I figure that was only because people are far too invested in their handicaps.

[jumbuck]

Go to the GOLF LINK site and have a look at your last rounds. GA has concocted a formula (go to their website for clear explanation) that does this.

It goes like this. Your handicap is 10. You shoot 85. The course par is 72. That's 13 over par you get 33 stableford points.
OK. Next we multilpy 13 by .93 = 12.9 multiply by 113 (slope average) =1366.17 divide by your course Slope (Blackwood SA) 128 = 10.67 (11) thats 83. You are 2 shots better than you think you were!!

[jumbuck]

Well what do think of us playing off low "PHONEY" handicaps that are difficult to play too?

[jumbuck]

Easy fixed. Just start your own competition.

It worked a gem for Kerry Packer in 1977.

Dotty. How about a serious reply. Any chance you can arrange a round at Kerrys course. I can get the helicopter.

[yoyo]

This thread needs pics

[3Puttpete]

Go to the GOLF LINK site and have a look at your last rounds. GA has concocted a formula (go to their website for clear explanation) that does this.

It goes like this. Your handicap is 10. You shoot 85. The course par is 72. That's 13 over par you get 33 stableford points.
OK. Next we multilpy 13 by .93 = 12.9 multiply by 113 (slope average) =1366.17 divide by your course Slope (Blackwood SA) 128 = 10.67 (11) thats 83. You are 2 shots better than you think you were!!

Ok now I understand your point and I'm pretty sure you're wrong.

Hcp 20
36 points
Slope 124

What's my played to?

[3Puttpete]

This thread needs pics

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1410439782.678514.jpg

[Dotty]

Dotty. How about a serious reply. Any chance you can arrange a round at Kerrys course. I can get the helicopter.

That was serious.

'Secondly Aussies are too slack, lazy and generally can't be bothered on mass to get off their collective "you know whats" to complain.'
Or the reason they don't complain, is that they do not have a justifiable reason to complain. (And thanks for the collective insult, five pound.)

Rave on.

[3oneday]

But if it is the same for everyone, why care? I play rain hail or shine, if I don't play to my 7 handicap life goes on.

I don't see the point in the new system, but I'm married too, so I just go with the flow

Drink more beer, unless you are a sad drunk, things usually become easier and looser that way.

[WBennett]

But if it is the same for everyone, why care? I play rain hail or shine, if I don't play to my 7 handicap life goes on.I don't see the point in the new system, but I'm married too, so I just go with the flow Drink more beer, unless you are a sad drunk, things usually become easier and looser that way.

Where is the like button?I havent broken handicap since early June and have not had a flag in nine. Yes, getting down to 5.8 reflected life best form, but now its reality. At least I dont have to wait 50 rounds at .1 to go out five. Just 20 rounds!

[aussieashley]

I have complained to Golf Australia (Simon Magdulski) that the new handicap system that uses only the best 8/20 of our rolling scores then multiplies that by "the bonus of excellence" .93 then multiplies that by your course slope and divides by 113 (ave slope) creates phoney handicaps that are very difficult to play to. Consequently it is ruining the (my and other Blackwood members) enjoyment of golf which is the main objective of Golf Australia.

Well what do think of us playing off low "PHONEY" handicaps that are difficult to play too?

But if it is the same for everyone, why care? I play rain hail or shine, if I don't play to my 7 handicap life goes on.

I don't see the point in the new system, but I'm married too, so I just go with the flow

Drink more beer, unless you are a sad drunk, things usually become easier and looser that way.

Welcome jumbuck. Like 3oneday says, it shouldn't matter if it's the same for everyone.
If everyone at your club played off their GA Handicap + 5 strokes, chances are the same guy will still win the day. Instead of winning with 39pts, he will have 44pts.
Will all of the people who would have had 31pts off their GA cap now be happier that they have had 36pts (playing off GA + 5)?

[Waddzy]

Welcome jumbuck. Like 3oneday says, it shouldn't matter if it's the same for everyone.
If everyone at your club played off their GA Handicap + 5 strokes, chances are the same guy will still win the day. Instead of winning with 39pts, he will have 44pts.
Will all of the people who would have had 31pts off their GA cap now be happier that they have had 36pts (playing off GA + 5)?

Yep , completely agree and wasn't this whole change to bring Australian handicaps in line with Americans so our best amateurs can qualify for larger events given our handicaps were generally higher due to our system? I cant see a real down side to it. Yes "old" scratch markers are nothing compared to the new scratch markers but we don't need to compare that as now everyone plays off the same system.

[hacker]

Welcome jumbuck. Like 3oneday says, it shouldn't matter if it's the same for everyone.
If everyone at your club played off their GA Handicap + 5 strokes, chances are the same guy will still win the day. Instead of winning with 39pts, he will have 44pts.
Will all of the people who would have had 31pts off their GA cap now be happier that they have had 36pts (playing off GA + 5)?

Short answer, no. Longer answer, no because the new whinge will be 'I play to my handicap and still can't win a f'n ball, because those f'n bandits get 40+ points'.

Am I close to the mark or way off? If I'm off just add 5 and it ill boost it up a bit.

[AndyP]

Jumbuck, as I have said a few times on this forum, the problem is the mentality that golfers think that they must be able to play to their handicap. They don't, it is just a number that GA calculates that is supposed to even the field in a competition.

Early this year, I decided to stop taking notice of playing to my handicap and set more realistic scoring goals. I have never played better.

[Matt1979]

I haven't found much difference in new vs old. My GA handicap is lower under the new system, but I only play where I am a member, so adjusted for slope it is about the same. Tbh I don't take too much notice of my handicap ( probably because it is so high ) - but I generally if I can get 33pts + I am more than happy with the day

[AndyP]

if I can get 33pts + I am more than happy with the day

Good attitude. I reckon 32-33pts is a good (and realistic) goal.

[Matt1979]

Good attitude. I reckon 32-33pts is a good (and realistic) goal.

Thanks. Find it makes a round more enjoyable, in that I still need to play well to get to the mark, but takes the stress out of not expecting to shoot 36 every week just to feel like I am breaking even!!

[Coldtopper]

Great to see the same Ozgolfers having a crack at someone new with an opinion!

Yes you are correct. The new handicapping system sux. And has contributed to making the game more unenjoyable imo for many myself included I get a good round every 5^th round or so with an ok score so I play off a handicap that under the old would have been 4 shots higher. The contributing influences that have determined that current handicapping system have come from the AGU wanting a international standard of handicapping for Aussie golfers. And that I understand!


BTW welcome and keep up the good work.

[coalesce]

Welcome jumbuck. Great first post

Because I'm a chopper, I can't comment on the effect that it has on low handicaps, but coming from the UK where the handicap system was different, I much prefer the GA system. My main reason is that the GA system accounts for form so much better.

In the UK system, if I had a great round and got 40+points, my handicap would have come in. If that was just the day that the planets aligned for me, it would take me a long time to go back out to where I should be. It wasn't a bad system providing your golf was always improving, but only going out usually 0.1 each time is a bit one-sided. With the 8/20 rounds, a good round will have an effect, but it is not everything.

As for slope, I get the idea - it is so that handicaps are portable from course to course. This is always going to be subjective. What about a course makes it more difficult? Not every player is the same. Plenty of high handicappers can bomb it a long way, so its not just length. There are almost certainly instances of the slopes being assessed wrong, but I don't see anything markedly better.

As for the 0.93 correction, I don't have a problem with that either. Recently, I've played with some very high handicappers, who expect to be playing "to their handicap" every round, but play off a social handicap they have given themselves of 36 because they are horribly inconsistent. These players occasionally have rounds where they score 40+ points and they think it is the norm of what they should be doing when they play well. A few have made the point above that getting 32+ points should be considered a decent enough day. Its a mindset change. Handicaps are designed to try and level the playing field at the level we all play at, based on a record of how we play. They are not necessarily designed to boost the ego by giving a high points score each time.

Has the way you play golf changed because the way handicaps are worked out has changed?

It is a great discussion topic tho

Anyway, as this is a welcome thread, I'll say welcome again! There's a few of us here in SA. Have a look in the 1st tee forum for threads where we get together monthly for a hit. On Sunday, for this month we are going to South Lakes. Previously we have been to places like Gawler, Fleurieu, Lady Bay...

[Webster]

Jumbuck,

Please post your golflink details so we can see how this is impacting on you and your enjoyment of the game.

[Oldplayer]

I agree with the op. I play at 13th Beach in Victoria which has a lot of good golfers as members. I have not found one lowcapper who likes the new system. The higher cappers seem to like it because as our slopes are quite high they get 3 or four shots more than their GA.
The former mid-low singles at our club now are all scratch or better. The low cap is good for bragging rights but that's about it.
I got down to 1 this winter because our DSR's were so high. I was shooting the course rating pretty much, well at least 7 out of 20 times. My normal score when the form is reasonably decent is between 75 and 79, about a 5-6 marker in the old language. Being off 1 or 2 when you are standing on the first tee on medal day, playing par off the back tees with the cold wind blowing is just no fun.
Give me the old system any-day.

[coalesce]

Is that a problem with the handicapping system, or the slope rating your course has been given?